Ishihara: TOKYO's TOO DAMNN HOTT

[westsan]

TOKYO IS ABNORMALLY HOT!!!!!!!!!
Japanese must be oblivious to the fact that this MAJOR METROPOLIS called Tokyo is too damnn hot.

I mean Tokyo is a big city. As a result, to a degree, it is unavoidable. But there are some things that Ishihara and the Japanese population needs ot get off their complacent asses and do:

- Make the sidewalk concrete!
-- (concrete is much denser than asphalt so it does not bring on as much heat, nor does it retain as much heat)
- Make wind thoroughfares thru the city.
-- (they need to rip right thru the city several straight lines with concrete streets
-- These concrete streets should have about 10 meters, wide, of grass in the middle of the street.)
- Make greenery along the sidewalk(not just trees) especially where there are new buildings.
- The parks should have grass.

Another thing is land reform in the metropolis of tokyo.
They need to make these several small plots of land into one and then they could implement central air conditioning...

If they could do all this it might make this city's economy and living here get a little better.

Does anybody else agree that this city is abnormally hot?

[Anonymous]

why don't you just go back to where you come from and stop whinging???your usual b.s.post.
p.s.do you know the word gaman???

[Wilmer]

All of Japan is hot these days...

But check out Europe. I heard that London was 37 degrees the other day - a record temperature, according to the news.

I was watching a clip about France, and Paris is unbelievably hot these days.

I guess we aren't alone in Japan.

Some of your ideas are good for a wish list, and might even cool the city down. Too bad none of your ideas are likely to come to reality in the next 1000 years or so. Tokyo is a big city, and it isn't that easy to make widespread changes (especially 10 metres of greenery in the middle of the street - that was a good one).

Just grin and bear it like the other 12 million people living in Tokyo, or the other 125 million living in Japan.

- Wilmer

[Васи]

To Wilmer
It is normal to have about 30-35 C in Southern Europe in the summer, for example, but the hotness there and what we have in Tokyo is completely different. Here because of the high humidity and the bad construction of the buildings we are in burning hell. In Europe, at least the buildings keep us cool, and in addition the air is cool and fresh in the mornings and in the evenings. In my apartment here in Tokyo the constant temperature is 33 degrees day and night without any change, morning, noon and evening. What is this??

[westsan]

Sendai is cool.
And so is Kiyosato.

BTW Andrew>> Im glad you like it. But is my post too negative? or is yours?

[Anonymous]

hey im from f**king texas.
this is normal to me.
except the humidity, that would be New Orleans style...
if you can't stand the heat move to the north.
I am from texas but even I hate the heat (even in texas!).
but you know, i think last summer was much worse, especially the humidity!

at least you can't fry eggs on a car in tokyo...

they do need insulation, double pane glass, etc... in ALL buildings in tokyo,
this would make heating and cooling efficient and cheaper!
oh yeah proper roofing materials can help too.

and the ceramic tiles (like a toilet stall)
that cover every building in japan CAN'T be helpful in reducing heat in summer or maintaining cool in winter.

[Wilmer]

Back,

Is it normal to have such high temperatures in Europe this time of year? I am curious as I have friends in the Netherlands, the UK, Germany, and France, but they say it is just too hot. I was reading on the news that the heat is actually resulting in deaths in France. By Southern Europe, do you mean Spain, Portugal, Southern France, Italy, etc.? I have never been to Europe myself, so it is interesting to see that the Japanese summer and the European summer are similar.

As far as the heat goes...Maybe it's all of the glass on the buildings reflecting the heat into the streets, and cooking everyone. Can't say I have ever lived in Tokyo, but down here in Aichi it is hot as bizalls, and getting hotter everyday. My apartment is mad hot as well...maybe the inch-thick walls don't help this.

Just keep guzzling back the water, and leave that a/c going as much as you can afford. Just think...in a few months the arctic winds will be screaming through the cities, and we will all be wondering why we ever cursed the heat.

- Wilmer

PS Nothing like a couple of cold ones to cut into the summer heat. Drink 'em fast, or they will go warm....ewwww...warm beer...

[westsan]

thats interesting that other places are this hot.
didnt know that.

Wilmer>>

There is nothing wrong with making sidewalks in Japan concrete.
Not unreasonable at all.

[reepo]

Westsan,DONT go back home and DONT stop whinging.(andrew)
If you feel you are being short changed you have a right-no an obligation-to complain.
Impatience is a virtue too and complacency is for unaspiring wimps.Nothin ever gets done by the people who "gaman suru".All these friggin optimists live in the clouds,pessimists live in the pits and on middle earth(the real world)you have the realists who get results.
Make noise.

[westsan]

reepo>> are you advocating urban terror? (^.^)

[daving]

If you can't take the heat, get out of the kitchen and welcome to Hokkaido. Five months down the road, if Hokkaido is too "abnormally" cold then welcome to hell, normally!

[EW]

Westan, if you are trying to get the Japanese to change the way they build their cities, then good luck! :) And given the average Japanese person's additude of "leave it to someone else" then Japan will continue to be like it is now for a very long time.

However, some cities - Nagoya for example - have much wider streets than Tokyo and some, quite a lot of greenery. Perhaps they are aiming for your dreams afterall?

I watched a show recently on t.v. that addressed this very issue. They were talking about putting material in the streets to lighten the color and thus increase its reflectivity and reduce the heat in the city. Anyone knows that the streets are still very warm well into the night because of soaking up the sun all day.

[westsan]

Nagoya gai>>>

I will say it again. It is asphalt asphalt asphalt asphalt that soaks up the heat.

Cement does not (not near the rate that asphalt does; I wouldnt hazard a guess but I am sure this info is free and available on the net).
I cannot imagine that changing sidewalks would not be economical in the short and long run.

[EW]

whoops! my bad! sorry, you're right. not cement, but asphalt. what you said!

Why don't we paint all the streets and sidewalks light blue like the insides of the swimming pools and run water across them all afternoon?

They could build water slides everywhere and we could just slide around town in our beach gear and stay cool that way!

[Raceace]

Maybe someone out there Gaijinpot land with a doctorate in thermal dynamics could explain the various pros and cons of asphalt versus concrete.

Try explaining the importance of wave lengths of light to an accountant
who is just trying to keep the city from sinking into the sea the cheapest
way he can.
If anyone has ever played simcity at cheetah pace would understand that
shear size and pace of Japanese city infrastructure is very difficult influence
inregards to town planning. Then there is that buzz word cronyism again,
which insures that the current system changes as little as possible.

We can see how blatantly lazy Japanese politicians are in creating new or altering legislation.
To create a bill that perhaps spaced buildings further apart to create better airflow, or a greenry ordinance would not take a
sitting of parliment but an act of god!
Can you imagine what a ordinance suddenly requiring all new buildings
to be an extra 4 meters apart would do to land values. Sewage/storm water management aside the costs would be mammoth
I think EW in a separate thread mentioned that during and after American
occupation there was a road widening scheme of sorts in Nagoya.
That was 50 years in the process in city quite smaller than Tokyo.
Tokyo being considerable larger and stubbonly established city the only
thing to make for wider streets would a tidal wave or long duration 5+ on the richter scale quake, thermonuclear strike heaven forbid!

And the temperature outlook for the future HOT HOT HOT!
so we all better go buy those funny hats with inbuilt fans and rose coloured glasses, cause she aint gonna change!
Besides who thinks Tokyo is really hot!
Come to Cairns in Australia which is only a stone skipping competition
from the equator and desert in it`s back yard.

[Anonymous]

You'll find that both concrete and asphalt absorb heat, though the main differences are in durability and cost.

The heating effect that you refer to is called the Urban Heat Island.

Try these links:

Urban Heat Islands by Matt Rosenberg
http://geography.about.com/library/weekly/aa121500a.htm

and some slides:

http://www.sfu.ca/~ianh/geog111/lectures/local%20climates/sld001.htm

[westsan]

Maybe so. But I think this will also effect Tokyo much:

governmental agencies working to decrease the temperatures of urban heat islands. This can be accomplished in several ways; most prominent are switching dark surfaces to light reflective surfaces [ie: concrete] and by planting trees.

U know...Rocket Science!

[Raceace]

Currently in Australia the practice of highways being made from asphalt
or Hotmix is on the wayout due to as Trip Hop mentioned cost and durability.

Asphalt is great for heating up and even worse for crumbling
under traffic. The worst thing with asphalt is the requirement for empecable
sub surface preparation. Tokyo I gather with it`s almost floating land mass
would be difficult to prevent moisture creeping up from the water table to
that first vital layer just below the hotmix. The temperature difference between the top and the bottom of the asphalt is want causes it to buckle. It then lets surface water errode the base under the asphalt to create more irregularities.
A friend who is a civil engineer said the asphalt problem is a love hate relationship.

Someone told me that the American goverment in the 70`s said dont
worry about the cost, let`s go concrete on the highways.
Steel mesh, boxing, scarifying the top for a non slip surface all add to cost
Please correct me if I`m wrong on that someone.
Someone even stated it was so military aircraft could still have somewhere
to land and takeoff in the event of a war. Sounds plausible I guess.

Concrete is the way to go! long term. It is working here in Australia where
the goverment is tendering out the road construction contacts. They dont
pay for much in that case and the tolls return the construction costs
to the successful tender.

However being a great reflector, it can be to hard for it`s own good.
Is it practical to create such long term surface in such a constantly metamorphisizing Tokyo.
Earthquakes would be a prime consideration as once a concrete road cracks you must remove quite a large section, but asphalt you just clean the crack and subsurface and refill with hotmix and then compress.
Quick cheap fix.

Does it make sense to have an overly durable road that is quite probably to be lifted to before it`s expiry date to make way for another section of city. Is lifting concrete more or less expensive than removing asphalt with crude oil components.
Question does the Japanese government conduct surveys to acutually
ascertain if high ambient temperatures contribute to lower worker output.
or productivety. If there is a significant link between high temps and GDP
I wonder if the goverment would get moving. nah all to hard, and I think they would try put the blame on something they knew they could`nt control.
Of course a cool worker is going to be a more productive worker but that is
easily fixed by turning up the a/c.

But yes trees would be a good start, but who going to water them?
A bit of a long winded one that....sorry!

Regards the Raceace.

[EW]

Whaddya mean, who's going to water them?!?!?!?

Just tell the guys that are peeing on the streets to aim for the base of a tree!

We save on toilet cleaning costs, the trees get water and a bit of nourishment, the city gets the greenery and cool factor, and these guys can now stick their chests out and be proud about taking a ____ in public!

Oh, and if chicks start doing it too, think of all the money the Japanese guys can save on those see-some-chick-take-a-____ photos and videos!

[westsan]

Yeah, US has lots of serrated concrete highways.
But I have noticed they curl up on the joints causing a jarring exp. at +55.

Japan may have trouble with it too on thier flyover highways tho.
Being heavy and all.

[westsan]

Yeah, US has lots of serrated concrete highways.
But I have noticed they curl up on the joints causing a jarring exp. at +55.

Japan may have trouble with it too on thier flyover highways tho.
Being perhaps too heavy and all.

[Raceace]

EW maybe your right, there might money to make from those trees yet eh!

If some whino willing to donate his nitrogen rich urea product to the "Keep the city cool scheme"all the better.

Gotta admit I not to keen on getting video footage of some drunk taking a slash! but
what rings your bell.(No not you!)
As for girls....... well lets just say they better bet really hot looking woman.
No matter how hot Tokyo gets watersports are a bit of a no go in my book
but a cute face will buy you some time!

Maybe the politicans dont want to make Tokyo cooler, maybe they want people to
utilize the a/c and for Kanto denryoku to make as much money as possible
so they can bribe city officals properly in the future.

[EW]

I think raceace has nailed the problem!

slick, this raceace is!

[westsan]

Yeah,, U know,,, Im almost thankful for the exhorbident electric bills in Japan.

[Sean]

One thing that pisses me off in my town is that at least twice a year city workers come around and cut every branch off of every tree on every street! In the middle of summer, you are walking down the street in the sweltering heat desperately looking for some shade and what do you find? A bunch of 20 year olds with bleached hair (being paid with my tax money) destroying the only shade available!

I just got back from a holiday in my home country Canada, and I noticed that there most streets in the cities are lined with nice big trees that provide tons of shade and make them not only attractive, but also cooler. When I come back to Japan, I see a bunch of leafless trunks sticking out of the ground that look like crap and provide no shade whatsoever. I can understand the need to prune trees so that they don't get tangled in electrical wires or block traffic, but for about 95% of the trees that get wacked this is not an issue. Its just that the local bureacrats are too lazy to come up with some sensible guidelines for how to take care of the city's trees, so they just say 'cut everything down'. That really gets on my nerves.

[EW]

I agree, but I think the idea is not to keep branches off the power lines, but rather to help insure the trees live to be 3 billion years old. You give it a stronger root/trunk by ridding it of the strength deplinishing branches.

Either way, I'd still go for the shade. Shall we go tie ourselves to a tree?

[westsan]

Sean you are so right.

Japanese are so into controling nature they clip and trim everything till there is nothing left.
Where Im from there are palm trees lining the streets where its dry and hot.
Oak and Carob and Maple trees other places.
Where there used to be train lines there are Eucalyptus trees all along the street.
But in Japan the only semblance of this are the scraggly mutilated sakura trees.

[Sean]

I actually don't think that the excessive pruning is good for the trees at all. I've noticed that on a lot of them the limbs tend not to re-grow their leaves after being cut too many times, probably because they don't do it right. A lot of them end up dying and being cut down completely.

That is true, westsan. The thing that strikes me is that Japanese gardeners have developed the most intricate and sophisticated methods of caring for gardens in such a way as to make them look completely natural. A lot of the well-pruned dwarf trees in people's gardens look fantastic. But when you walk down the street in just about any city here, all you see are the deformed trunks of trees butchered by municipal workers. There is no green in the cities, and it is damned depressing to look at.

[westsan]

> Might I recomend a long summer holiday....

or a class in civil engineering 101 for every Tokyo bureaucrat - and Ishihara

[Sean]

Yeah, all those air conditioners sure don't help. That is another big pain, walking down the street and suddenly being hit by a wave of superheated air being pumped out of one of those. We don't have an air conditioner in our apartment, we just use electric fans and actually find that they are pretty adequate in keeping you cool. I don't think the cool air from air conditioners is too healthy either, makes my sinuses dry up.

[Code Rot]

The recent heatwaves are a sign that Japan should abandon its love affair with concrete and ashphalt, and get back to Nature.
A lot of Japanese will say that ashphalt and concrete are beautiful because they are clean.
They will then go on to say that "Only Japanese people understand Nature -- Gaijin don't understand nature."
But I reckon the average Gaijin understands Nature better than the average Japanese.

[kurogane]

Yes, but they invented Pocky. Pretty hard to argue with that one.

[Code Rot]

So that's the limit of Japanese inventiveness?
Pocky sticks?

[kurogane]

I think that would be Pocky that doesn't melt even in this over-paved environment. No?

Sort of like an Everlasting Gobstopper for a hyper-modern environment.

Oompa Loompah