View Full Version : re-cycled building materials in Okayama
Hi all. I've been following the Country Living forum for a fair while and figured it's about time I actually wrote something.
I'm currently waiting on my nouchihou application before finding out if I can buy the land we've chosen over in Okayama, and I was wondering if any of the posters here are living near-by (relatively speaking). If all the paperwork goes through as planned, we'll be moving onto our 1200 tsubo in July and first thing to do will be getting a house up before the winter sets in. If anyone has any local leads for sourcing used windows, doors, timber, roofing etc. I'd appreciate hearing about them here.
Cheers.
johnElarue
2010-04-15, 03:30 PM
Hi gomu and welcome,
Sorry no links to building materials off the top of my head but will look around. I'm in central Hyogo by the way. Are you looking to farm full time?
john
myhobbyis
2010-04-15, 03:48 PM
Hi all. I've been following the Country Living forum for a fair while and figured it's about time I actually wrote something.
I'm currently waiting on my nouchihou application before finding out if I can buy the land we've chosen over in Okayama, and I was wondering if any of the posters here are living near-by (relatively speaking). If all the paperwork goes through as planned, we'll be moving onto our 1200 tsubo in July and first thing to do will be getting a house up before the winter sets in. If anyone has any local leads for sourcing used windows, doors, timber, roofing etc. I'd appreciate hearing about them here.
Cheers.
Sorry Gomu, no information for you so just a welcome.
1200 tsubo's a good size, should keep your hands full ! I'm on half of that here in Mie. You did well to find a place with that amount attached. Hope it goes well for you.
Thanks for the warm welcome, folks.
Yup, 1200坪 should keep me busy for a while indeed. I'm thinking that we'll gradually build up to full time farming. Once we get the nouchihou application cleared, we'll probably qualify for the 15 man-a-month "New Farmer Kakuho" that the district offers. Not sure how many months they pay it for but it'll relieve some of the financial pressure for a bit. I'll probably also commute into Osaka and do a two day week of 'old me' work, crash with a mate overnight then back to the land for the other 5 days. For as long as I can hack it, that is.
I reckon on spending the first 3 or 4 years getting the land/soil into shape, observing the land in different seasons, trying out a few ideas I have and coming up with a design for the plot. There's an awful lot to think about as far as long term strategy goes, but hey, it's not like I'm going anywhere once I've ponied up, eh.
@myhobbyis: Before deciding on Okayama we looked at some land on the Nara/Mie border. Down Totsugawa way. Steep ravines out there... Stunning scenery, but hard land to farm, I thought. You're farming your land there, right?
@johnE: I'm in Hyogo atm. Small world, eh. I lived here my first three years in Japan, then moved off and tried different flavours of Kansai for 15 years or so. Been back here for the last 3 years now. Lovely part of the country. Just not quite far enough from the metropolis to make a decent chunk of land affordable, sadly, and too mountainous to appeal to me for farming as you go further north.
I see that there are one or two forumites in Okayama. It'd be good to hear from you guys too, whether you've got leads on building stuff or not. Always nice to get an insider's pov on a place. Saves too many nasty surprises ;-)
Cheers again.
KenElwood
2010-04-16, 06:36 AM
Hi gomu and welcome,
...we'll be moving onto our 1200 tsubo in July and first thing to do will be getting a house up before the winter sets in.
Noice move, and good luck with it.
I reckon on spending the first 3 or 4 years getting the land/soil into shape, observing the land in different seasons, trying out a few ideas I have and coming up with a design for the plot. There's an awful lot to think about as far as long term strategy goes, but hey, it's not like I'm going anywhere once I've ponied up, eh.
Maybe it's just my location, but has anybody else noticed an up-tick in really windy days over the past coupla years or so ?! It's to the point where it's strong enough to generate energy with a wind- turbine, but strong enough to be a nuisance, too. In retrospect, I should've planted a living hedge 1.5 years ago.
ken
Antweazle
2010-04-16, 08:49 AM
gomu- congrats on your purchase!
Not exactly the items you are seeking, however was able to get a LOT of useful sized timber and ply sheets from skip-diving (dumpster diving). Fortunately, there was a 'small town' of mini-houses erected on tiny blocks opposite my city residence and I had permission to pirate anything in the rubbish. Filled the kei-van twice a week.
Drive around town and find some construction; builders are always happy to give their blessing.
Very best luck!
myhobbyis
2010-04-16, 10:07 AM
@myhobbyis: Before deciding on Okayama we looked at some land on the Nara/Mie border. Down Totsugawa way. Steep ravines out there... Stunning scenery, but hard land to farm, I thought. You're farming your land there, right?
Cheers again.
Hi again Gomu,
We looked at some land there too and concur. As a fly fisherman the Totsugawa looks delectable, stunning setting to not catch any fish in :p.
We are on the Ise peninsular which has a great coastline but is not so remote. 'Farming my land' sounds a little too grandiose, I'm 'hobbying' my land i guess, not commercial. Been here just 3 years so bringing everything on while holding a regular job, it all takes time. There 's a lot to be said for slow ponderous develpoment mind you because it gives time for ideas to come. And getting there's the fun bit anyway so why rush it ? :)
myhobbyis
2010-04-16, 10:10 AM
Maybe it's just my location, but has anybody else noticed an up-tick in really windy days over the past coupla years or so ?! It's to the point where it's strong enough to generate energy with a wind- turbine, but strong enough to be a nuisance, too. In retrospect, I should've planted a living hedge 1.5 years ago.
ken
Yes, seconded Ken. I took the bamboo poles away from my biggest olive saplings last weekend then put them on again about the next day as they were practically bending horizontal in the wind ! Tough as nails mind you those beloved olives.
has anybody else noticed an up-tick in really windy days over the past coupla years or so ?
I'd agree with that. I've been sailing (http://www.out-of-the-blue.info/the-boat/) in Osaka Wan/Setonaikai for the last dozen years or so and it's been getting better and better all that time. The first few years the only good sailing to be had was the couple of days either side of the typhoons. Summer has always been mill-pond like, but winds the rest of the year have definitely been getting stiffer. One of the features that helped us decide on this particular piece of land is that it has an L-shaped 'screen' of 30~40 year growth sugi running around the two 'exposed' sides of it (South and East), forested mountainside to the north and a lightly wooded strip along the western border, the one with the view down the valley. I figured that it'll be nicely sheltered both from the height of the summer sun and any blows that come up or down the valley.
@ant. yup, I'll be keeping one eye out on building sites, and the other on demolition sites. I've sourced enough matsu for the main posts and beams (a steal at jpy500 per 10m, well seasoned 25-30yo trees), and have enough mixed cordwood for the walls up to the window-sils. It's finding doors and windows that worries me.
Just as an aside, and if I should start a new thread for it just say, but does anyone have any experience with round timber reciprocal roofs (http://www.google.com/images?q=Reciprocal+Roof)?
johnElarue
2010-04-16, 04:44 PM
Maybe it's just my location, but has anybody else noticed an up-tick in really windy days over the past coupla years or so ?! It's to the point where it's strong enough to generate energy with a wind- turbine, but strong enough to be a nuisance, too. In retrospect, I should've planted a living hedge 1.5 years ago.
ken
I don't think I've noticed an increase cause it seems to often be quite windy by us. In fact we usually have enough wind to hopefully make power a few days a week. It often blows just under or near the same speed as the inlet between Awaji and Wakayama, when southerly.http://www.jma.go.jp/en/amedas/211.html?elementCode=1
gomu- glad to have another sailor around, though I sail a much smaller Aquamuse 141 on the lake around here, finicky wind there due to the mountains though. You mentioned cordwood, and circular roofs, are you going to do a cordwood masonry home? I want to do a small cabin/classroom in the backyard someday. Your location sounds good, well laid out, congrats on the full acre.
john
Aquamuse are those sailing canoes, aren't they? My first boat here was a sailing canoe. Built one for me and one for a friend. Huge fun. We got the plans from Ian Oughtred and really pi__ed the neighbours off with all the hammering and sawing at all hours (lived in an apartment at the time...)
Here's a pic.
http://www.sail-japan.info/site/uploads/photos/130.jpg
As for the house, yes. Pier foundations with a 10m diameter, timber framed circular house under a 12m dia reciprocal roof. Cordwood/mortar fill to the window sills and lath 'n plaster from the sills on up... or so stands the plan atm. Haven't decided on roofing yet. I wanted to do a living roof, but spoke with a builder here who's done a couple and said that either the soil washes off in the typhoons or rot sets in... can't help but think that he's been doing it wrong, but it's put a grain of doubt in my mind.
KenElwood
2010-04-17, 05:50 AM
Hey mhi,
I took the bamboo poles away from my biggest olive saplings last weekend then put them on again about the next day as they were practically bending horizontal in the wind ! Tough as nails mind you those beloved olives.
Same here ! I've been reading a lot lately about the uses of hedge growing/laying as windbreaks in England, and it really makes sense to me. Thinking about giving it a go just as soon as I finish my post & three pole fence project around the garten here. Hopefully I can grow and lay something like this (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Newly_laid_hedge.jpg):
http://www.wyrebc.gov.uk/Page.aspx?ImgID=374
Hi gomu, noice website and canoes - enjoyed 'em. :-) No experience with reciprocal roofs, sorry.
One of the features that helped us decide on this particular piece of land is that it has an L-shaped 'screen' of 30~40 year growth sugi running around the two 'exposed' sides of it (South and East), forested mountainside to the north and a lightly wooded strip along the western border, the one with the view down the valley. I figured that it'll be nicely sheltered both from the height of the summer sun and any blows that come up or down the valley.
I can just imagine it. If ye the time, pictures please. :-)
Hey johnE,
I don't think I've noticed an increase cause it seems to often be quite windy by us. In fact we usually have enough wind to hopefully make power a few days a week. It often blows just under or near the same speed as the inlet between Awaji and Wakayama, when southerly.http://www.jma.go.jp/en/amedas/211.html?elementCode=1
Right, got it.
ken
Ken said:
I can just imagine it. If ye the time, pictures please. :-)
'ere you go.
a panorama taken from roughly the middle of the plot:
http://out-of-the-blue.info/images/misc/guibiPanorama1.jpg
and an aerial pic from yahoomaps:
http://out-of-the-blue.info/images/misc/Picture 4.png
karamatsu
2010-04-17, 09:34 AM
Wow, cool project!
Is 1200 tsubo enough nochi to get permission to build? I can't remember how much it was. Are you going off grid?
Folks now get eco-points for putting new windows in, so if they're not doubling up, it should mean more old ones to be had. Single pane, but I don't suppose Okayama gets that cold.
I guess most old doors and windows in Japan will be 180cm high or less.
@ karamatsu
You're right, it's not quite enough land to get the Nouchihou, but I've taken a short term rental on a chunk of land which would bring the total up to the required 5 tan, once I get the nouchiho I can let the rental land go back to its owner and Bob's your uncle. In the south-west corner of the 'inverted L' is just under 100 tsubo classified as 'Genya' (you can see in the aerial pic that it's more green than the rest of the plot) so I'll be building there at first. When money permits, I might subdivide a part of the plot as 'Takuchi' and build a more permanent place up the hill a bit. I'd be able to make better use of my grey water and get a better view to boot.
I want to go off grid as soon as possible, but at the beginning I'll get electric brought to the land so that I can power the tools I'll be using to build the house. Apparently it's possible to connect for free as the nearest utility pole is within 500m. Water is prefecture supplied agricultural mains atm, but I'll be digging a well for potable water. There's already a fair amount of runoff from the mountain and I'll be collecting rainwater. I'll need a couple of ponds but have yet to decide where to put them.
Just found an old Jusco (supermarket) being demolished and will be meeting a man about the windows on Monday. They have big double glazed refrigerator doors too and I'm wondering if I couldn't rip the glass out of the frames and use it somehow. More as it happens!
KenElwood
2010-04-17, 12:38 PM
Hey gomu,
Really, really stoked to read yer plans and {see} the land ! This is exactly what I was planning to do 4 years ago in a different part of Japan, but I had "to go see about a garten" :-) Over the years I've been saving up links to how-to building, so here you go:
・The Cob Builders Handbook (http://www.weblife.org/cob/), most of the book free online.
・All Things Cordwood (http://www.daycreek.com/dc/HTML/allthingscordwood.htm)
・Green Home Building (http://www.greenhomebuilding.com/index.htm), lots of info!
・The Year of Mud (http://small-scale.net/yearofmud/), a cob house built and documented.
・Cob house photo gallery (http://www.cobworks.com/photo-gallery/)
・Mike Oehler's underground housing (http://www.undergroundhousing.com/index.html) site.
Anyway, a full acre there sounds quite, and are those a coupla tanbo in the picture there - Planning to grow rice or wheat, or seeding it all over with clover and growing an orchard ? Would love to hear yer overall plans for the place.
ken
Hey Ken,
many thanks for the links, will work my way through them while I have access to the web.
So, the plan, eh? Well.....
This land was originally hatake rather than tanbo. We looked at a bunch of tanbo before picking this place and the same thing kept coming to mind: The thing about tanbo is the sheer wetness of the darned things! if we'd bought tanbo then we'd have had to move up to a meter of topsoil/substrate off of any area we wanted to build on. Not that it's so difficult to do, but it seemed kind of sacrilegious, if you get my drift. Not to mention that we'd have to put it all somewhere.
A close second in the running was a 3,500 tsubo hillside with forest at top, a pond/tank (tameike) and 7 narrow rice terraces going down the hill. It was great except for the wetness and the gradient of the place. Would have been great for the thigh muscles, but I just kept on coming back to drainage and slippage. Probably would have been too much for just my wife and I to manage, all truth be told. Here's a pic:
http://out-of-the-blue.info/images/misc/sho-ocho-600.jpg
It's still available (5.8mil) if anyone's interested. [edit: Sold]
We opted for the smaller place and think that it was probably a wise decision, all things considered, not least of which is that being cheaper we get a whack of change from our budget meaning that other necessities can be taken care of more quickly.
My wife is a big fan of Kawaguchi (http://iwazumi2000.cool.ne.jp/)/Fukuoka (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Masanobu_Fukuoka) style "自然農", and I've been reading/studying/doing permaculture (in a very small suburban garden) for a fair while. In fact I'm off to the UK for a couple of weeks next month to do a refresher design course. So the land is going to be a kind of hybrid of the two methods (not that they're so different in many respects). There'll probably be a goodly amount of experimentation going on in the process.
The rice field you see at the bottom left of the earlier pic is not actually our land, but the fella who's using it now must be in his 80s and we'll be making a point of staying friendly with him and the other neighbours. Who knows, we might get to rent/buy some of the adjoining land in time.
I'm keen to try the dry mountain variety of rice a-la-Fukuoka (interplanted with other grains), but unless we get access to a tanbo, I'd be happy to let the rice production slide us by. Seems like a shame to change the hatake to tanbo, and there are no doubt enough mozzies there already. I'm also keen to try and get as many trees on the property as is practical. Fruit, nuts, coppice... any advice on sources for species that thrive here much appreciated. Vege will be big and herbs/spices too. Chickens/guinea fowl/ducks too, once I've got the ponds sorted out.
All this sounds good and well, but to be honest none of it's written in stone. Getting on to the land will be the start of realistic planning, and as I intimated in an earlier post, the first few years are going to be spent getting the land back into good nick and sussing the place out.
Man, this has been a lifetime in the dreaming, and I'm somewhat in awe of the fact that I've actually got around to getting the whole thing rolling. Seriously looking forward to making a start and will no doubt be asking for help (informational, moral and muscular) here on the forums over time. As they say with utmost good manners and deference, 宜しくお願いいたします！
Edit: That land (above) has been sold, btw
julian s
2010-04-17, 01:55 PM
Hi gomu
I'm afraid I have absolutely nothing useful to add, but just wanted to say WOW and how impressed I am by your plans. Fantastic!
Looking forward to reading and seeing how it all pans out over the coming months.....years!
Cheers, Julian. Got a project in mind for yourself?
KenElwood
2010-04-17, 06:46 PM
Hi again gomu, great stuff. Dreams do come true. :-) The land there (the bit you purchased) and yer ideas reminded of two things:
・Mountain forest farm (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmM4IFt0F8Y&feature=PlayList&p=0603C3F0319A93FC&index=0#t=7m12s). Over 4o years ago this guy in the highlands of Austria’s “fir desert” started terracing the hillside and planting fruit trees. The results are remarkable ! [Vid]
・Ken Fern (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8IBT5odmZq0#t=6m36s). This guy gardens on 28 acres, and has got an online plant database (http://server9.web-mania.com/users/pfafardea/database/D_obtain.html) of 7ooo plant species ! [Vid]
Both of which i'm practicing to an extent on less than 4oo tsubo in the lowlands of Aichi:
http://kenelwood.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/gartenfromabove1.jpg
I write here (http://kenelwood.wordpress.com/).
Cheers,
ken
Ken, that 'Mountain Forest' vid is superb! Many thanks for the link. Food for the soul.
I have to confess that I've been reading your blog for a while. Great posts and yet another source of inspiration. I think what you're doing on your land there is great and the fact that so many people, due to its location will be able to see it, is valuable in itself.
I know that Shitara san has got the Japanese Permaculture org up and running, though he seems a bit worried that he won't be able to get enough students this year according to his site (link (www.pccj.net)), but has anyone here established any links with Japanese permaculturists?
KenElwood
2010-04-17, 09:13 PM
You bet on the video links gomu :-).
I'd love hands-on experience working the land with a fun group, but I can't afford to pay a hundred dollars a day for a permaculture class. So what I do instead, is just read about stuff online, archive it, share it, maybe write something up on it, remember 1/2 of it, try 1/5 of it in the garten, forget most of what I did, learn maybe 2 things a week, repeat.
Thanks for commenting over at me blog. You're right, Japan's dropout sub-culture is up to different things than them of the West, and I admit that my tweaking of that bit from Time was brazingly optimistic.
ken
I can't afford to pay a hundred dollars a day for a permaculture class.
Indeed, I think (and sorry if this treads on any toes) that the trouble with 'Permaculture' in Japan is that it's often treated as a money making fad, much like the Lohas, slow food, iturn/uturn, organic, herbal-life, phenomena have all been. Probably started out with good intentions, but fell into the inevitable capitalist trap... but I digress.
Now, if there's a touch of mutual aid in your soul, as I suspect there is, you might like to check out the anarchist (my label, not his) natural farmer Kawaguchi (http://iwazumi2000.cool.ne.jp/). He doesn't charge anything for his courses, just leaves a donation box on a table. Last time I was at Akame there must have been 100 people there to listen/learn with him. Inspiring stuff.
ひさしぶり
2010-04-17, 10:06 PM
http://i582.photobucket.com/albums/ss267/Temptationbucket/1510.gif
KenElwood
2010-04-18, 05:09 AM
gomu,
Now, if there's a touch of mutual aid in your soul, as I suspect there is, you might like to check out the anarchist (my label, not his) natural farmer Kawaguchi (http://iwazumi2000.cool.ne.jp/). He doesn't charge anything for his courses, just leaves a donation box on a table. Last time I was at Akame there must have been 100 people there to listen/learn with him. Inspiring stuff.
Thanks for this.
Cheers,
ken
johnElarue
2010-04-18, 08:30 AM
Awesome link, thanks
hey gomu,
just want to jump in here and echo all the stoke and encouragement that everyone else has voiced. i'm sure your hands will be full for months to come but if you could give an update on here every so often i'm sure we'd all appreciate it.
a good friend of mine just bought a plot (actually many plots joined together) similar to yours. he's got 7 tan now (for a bargain price of 110 man) and will double that as additional deals are worked out with neighboring owners. his land consists of tanbo, hatake, and a small piece zoned for a home. his first step is bringing the tanbos back to life, then planting the field with some cash crops, and then building a house - all by the end of the year!
he had been searching for property for a few years with cooperation from a local ngo/farm elders group that works to find new owners for abandoned, unused, and unwanted land. so, my question is how did you go about finding your piece of land? i've got some similar dreams and i'd love to hear how it all came together!
good luck with it all. an exciting time it must be....
Thanks for the encouragement, every little bit helps!
110 man for 7 tan is pretty good going, there. Which region is he buying in? As for having all that done by the end of the year, I wish him luck. One thing I've learnt with big projects like this is that it takes about three times your original 'worst case' predictions. It does me, anyway.
I posted a bunch of fudosan (http://forum.gaijinpot.com/showpost.php?p=948743&postcount=3998) in one of the other threads here a day or two ago. I pestered them all for about half a year, spent every weekend away from home visiting candidate plots and talked with as many people standing in fields as I came across :eek:
Finally got introduced to this plot via a builder who was helping me locate materials for a house that I was planning to build on a different plot.
I'll certainly keep folks here updated.
julian s
2010-04-19, 11:31 AM
Cheers, Julian. Got a project in mind for yourself?
Hi again, gomu
Nah, no projects for me. At least nothing like yours. We moved into a house with just a small amount of land just over a year ago. I'm in the laborious process of turning the land into something I can actually grow stuff on. For a small amount of land, there's a helluva lot of stones, rubble and random junk buried in it.
Meantime, I'm afraid I'm an armchair permaculturalist.
gomu, thanks for posting all those links. i went through them all and found just a few properties listed in my area, Miyazaki. for some reason, this area has a dearth of the old farmhouse/traditional properties seen everywhere else in japan. if you go far enough back in the mountains you will occasionally stumble upon one or two, but they just aren't that common.
my friend's property is too far from the ocean (an hour) for my tastes, though in that region there does seems to be quite a lot of old land. he found and rented a similar, but smaller, piece of land last year that was only tambo. he brought in some heavy machinery and within a month he had the whole thing divided in 12 tambo and irrigated from the mountain stream that runs alongside it. his plan for that property was to buy the overlooking lot and put his house there but the owner wouldn't sell so he had to keep searching. he's a builder by trade so he's probably better equipped than most of us....but i do have doubts - if he finishes his house by year-end i'll be damn impressed! coincidentally, he's the second friend i have building a house this summer; so this will be a busy summer for me too.
interesting stuff about kawaguchi and his donation box. there's a natural farming school in nearby Aya (somewhat famous pioneering organic town) that we visit occasionally but the classes always costs a bit of money. have you met anyone that farms full-time using kawaguchi's methods? it always seems like housewives and retirees make up the bulk of the students and i've yet to see any farms implementing primarily his methods. that said, i follow a fukuoka/permaculture mix so i'm not knocking it - but sometimes the kawaguchi followers i meet are very narrow minded and dislike 'organic' farming almost as much as 'conventional' farming. though kawaguchi and fukuoka are closely related, i've yet to meet a fukuoka follower with such strong opinions....
sorry to run off topic here. again, best of luck with your project!
@rza
Re: Kawaguchi
I've met a few folks who employ Kawaguchi's methods on their land, but none who do so exclusively. Any 'ordinary' farmer I mention "Shizen Nouho" to gives me a worldly stare and says "Ah... but does it work?" I think it has a reputation for not bearing results for 30 years or so. Whether that's justified or not, I wouldn't know just yet :)
As for his students, 'deshi' might be a more appropriate word, I was surprised by their youthfulness. I'd guess that on the days I've been there, the under 40s have out numbered the older age groups 3:1. Which is a cool thing. Gives one hope for the future generations. However, there is a sense of the 'awed by the great master' or something spiritual about them, which kind of puzzled me as he strikes me as being far less spiritual in his approach than Fukuoka appears to have been, and much more anarchistic. Other than the obvious intrigue about his methods and his physical proximity to my neck of the woods, it was the wording of the Akame site (that I linked to) that made me go and take a look for myself. The Juku he runs is very much a "Come if you want, pay if you want, ask me questions if you want, if you want to pick up a kama that's cool too. I'll be here farming and you're welcome to join me." type of affair.
I like that while he's obviously making a living through it, he's not one to employ 'catch copy' or marketing crap, nor is he one of those outfits that plays to the Japanese' apparent need for certificates or 'kyu's and wotnot.
As for being far from the sea, I know what you mean. I'm a sailor and moving into the hills is going to have me pining I'm sure. Still, I got so tired of sailing amongst Osaka's flotsam and jetsam out in the bay that, as I didn't choose to live down in Kyushuu (which has some of the most beautiful sailing to be had here imho) I don't see myself sailing regularly for a good few years. Even sold my boat :(
Like I said, best of luck to your mate. See if you can persuade him to post here. It'd be great to see what other projects are going on.
gomu, thanks for the additional perspective on kawaguchi. seems we've got a different breed of followers down here.
we've seen his farming manual (written by one of his students) a few times and always enjoyed it. we'll probably buy a copy someday. but i've always wondered why that book hasn't been translated into English. i'm sure it'd be popular and a nice introduction of the kawaguchi name to the rest of the world. maybe it's because of what you were saying.....he's not doing it to profit. in which case, i should buy that book.
Another book to look out for is Kiseki no ringo by Kimura Akinori. He's the apple farmer whose wife got sick thanks to all the chemicals they were using and spent 10 years without producing a single apple while sussing out his own way of cultivating them without the help of chemicals. 'Shizen-saibai' as he calls it to distinguish it from 'Shizen-nou' (Kawaguchi) and 'Shizen-nouhou' (Fukuoka), though he credits both men as having had a great influence on him.
He's probably the most down to earth of the three (imo), though he swears blind he's met aliens...
dataGecko
2010-04-22, 05:27 PM
'ere you go.
a panorama taken from roughly the middle of the plot:
http://out-of-the-blue.info/images/misc/guibiPanorama1.jpg
Hey gomu, belated welcome to the board, and like everyone else, wow! Excellent start to your project, and I have to say I'm impressed with your find. It looks like a great bit of land you have found. As you may or may not have read back in the posts, Okayama is at the top of our list as a place to settle in the future, so your progress is of particular interest for me to follow. :-) If you are happy to do so, can you PM me the location of your land, and I'd be quite interested to know what else was around there? The link being... the idea thats been peculating along now for a while about possible semi-intentional communities, should that be something of interest to you. ;-)
I've set you up on HBS by the way, sorry for that delay.
.... And the reason for the delay was that I've just spent five days WWOOFing on a local organic farm up in the mountains south of Brisbane. It would have been a bit longer but the rain has set in, and I've got a million things to do here, so we came home early. We have our own seedlings ready to plant out here. :-)
It was good timing though as its mainly a veggie farm (60 types of produce) and its planting season, so we timed it well for some interesting work - preparing beds and planting out. They use a trench worm farm compositing technique. Rather then turn the soil, they dig a trench and pile the lifted soil to make raised beds beside the trench, then they add manure and compost, and some organic fertilizer (plus some lime to add calcium and to break up the clay) plus a generous layer of mulch on top and to the sides of the raised beds. The worms already in the soil from the previous seasons (and there were HEAPS!) go to work breaking this all down. They then plant directly into the raised beds, with the idea that the nutrients from the trenches either side feed the growing plants. They do also use liquid fertilizer in the irrigation and regular watering. Its an interesting approach, and certainly seems to be generating results for them, though I can't help but wonder at the level of inputs required. Sure its organic inputs, but still seems a bit of expense, but they reckon you have to put back in what the plants take out, and while they compost, they simply can't make enough to keep up with commercial production levels. They have 5 acres of veggies, and they believe that 10% of the income they make needs to go back into the soil (fertilizers and mulch) to keep the soil healthy.
One interesting aspect is that they don't fence they veggies, or use any herbicides or sprays (naturally), but because the soil is really healthy, and therefore the plants, they have no problems with browsing animals or other pests. We were quite amazed, but it seems to be true. Neighboring properties get hit, but they seem to be left alone, and they've been doing this for over 10 years now. Their belief is that only unhealthy soil attracts pests.
They also setup and run a weekly local produce market, and we were able to check that out on the day before we started. Got some good ideas for a simple system that lets small scale producers sell produce with minimal fuss and effort. They have been doing that for seven years, and its going well.
Anyway, its was an interesting, though brief, experience and has given me a few more ideas to mull over.
Antweazle
2010-04-22, 06:27 PM
gomu- apple-ologies if this is going off topic!
One interesting aspect is that they don't fence they veggies, or use any herbicides or sprays (naturally), but because the soil is really healthy, and therefore the plants, they have no problems with browsing animals or other pests. We were quite amazed, but it seems to be true. Neighboring properties get hit, but they seem to be left alone, and they've been doing this for over 10 years now. Their belief is that only unhealthy soil attracts pests.
Can't beat hands-on experience, ay mate? Love to hear of any other unique ideas you and the Missus picked up.
I'd be quite amazed as well that 'roos, etc. left the veggies alone. Then again, as the PNG people say, "the only pest critters are hungry critters". Actually, they don't say that at all, but that's what me Olde Dad translated from pidgeon after living there a few years. Throw a few sweet potatoes over the fence and everyone's happy.
Photo of a culprit taken on a game camera rooting my veggie garden:
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e105/NormGunston/MDGC0005.jpg
Hey Gecko. Many thanks for the greets and for sorting me out on BlackSheep too. Lots of catching up to do :D
I'll send you YahooMap co-ords for the plot in a moment, but should reply to this post first.
So, you're in Oz but thinking to move over here? Is that right? J partner, I presume. Cool.
The area I'm hopefully going to be setting up in (waiting to hear back from the Nogyou Inkai) is in Sho-o-cho. It's a beautiful place, 10 mins from the Mimasaka IC on the Chugoku-do, and an hour and a half's drive from the Kanjo-sen (loop) in Osaka. There's a bunch of viable but un-used farm land in the vicinity, and if the intentional community idea is still of interest, it would be an excellent place to consider setting it up.
Sho-o-cho is one of the few districts in Okayama that is operating in the black, mainly thanks to the taxes paid by several large manufacturers with plants there. Despite the industrial infrastructure, the district is large enough that in most places you'd never guess that it had any industry at all. Land here is very well priced, with san-rin going way cheaper than agricultural land. 10 acres (http://www.inaka-gurashi.co.jp/content/view/567/125/) for 580万円 anyone?
Your WWOOFing sounds cool, but I'm also surprised by the no fencing idea. I'll be putting up electric fences until I get a good hedge established, that's for sure. Antweasle's pic looks likely to be a nightly occurrence there.
( take a look at this vid (http://www.contech-inc.com/bear.avi) and see what made the bear jump here (http://www.contech-inc.com/products/scarecrow/). There's a Japanese distributor (http://www.yuukoumarine.jp/contech/contech.htm) too. What d'ya think?)
johnElarue
2010-04-22, 11:33 PM
Lots of interesting stuff going on here guys, very much enjoying it,
I can't believe the prices of land out there gomu, I think you and gecko will hit it off pretty well.
antweazle nice pic, where did you get your game-cam?
Antweazle
2010-04-23, 08:45 AM
antweazle nice pic, where did you get your game-cam?
Cabela's in the US. Ordered plenny gear through them. Fast, reliable and have proven that their returns policy works. Got some excellent deer pics from last year's rut, too.
http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templates/product/standard-item.jsp?_DARGS=/cabelas/en/common/catalog/item-link.jsp_A&_DAV=MainCatcat602025-cat20098&id=0046650417898a&navCount=1&podId=0046650&parentId=cat20098&masterpathid=&navAction=push&catalogCode=9IS&rid=&parentType=index&indexId=cat601233&hasJS=true
johnElarue
2010-04-23, 11:28 AM
Cabela's in the US. Ordered plenny gear through them. Fast, reliable and have proven that their returns policy works. Got some excellent deer pics from last year's rut, too.
http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templates/product/standard-item.jsp?_DARGS=/cabelas/en/common/catalog/item-link.jsp_A&_DAV=MainCatcat602025-cat20098&id=0046650417898a&navCount=1&podId=0046650&parentId=cat20098&masterpathid=&navAction=push&catalogCode=9IS&rid=&parentType=index&indexId=cat601233&hasJS=true
Excellent, thanks for that. I had forgotton about them, my brother swears by their clothing.
john
Now back to the acreage at hand
I can't believe the prices of land out there gomu
I know. I've been looking at land prices on and off for 20+ years here, and they're the cheapest I've ever seen them right now.
Inaka Bryan
2010-04-24, 12:48 AM
I know. I've been looking at land prices on and off for 20+ years here, and they're the cheapest I've ever seen them right now.
You said it. The best deals are found by asking around though. We've learned that the realator's selection is small in comparison to what is potentially available. And you can get great deals by talking to locals in the know. Once you settle and start getting plugged into the community you may find that your neighbors are practically giving their land (or the use of it) to you just so someone will keep it from being overtaken by the forest.
Once you settle and start getting plugged into the community you may find that your neighbors are practically giving their land (or the use of it) to you just so someone will keep it from being overtaken by the forest.
Quite right. That's why I only bought an acre. It's meant as a "door opener", the valley we chose seems to have 40~50% of the land abandoned or not being actively farmed and hopefully, little by little we'll be able to expand our plot.
karamatsu
2010-04-24, 11:57 AM
Thanks for the reply gomu. It sounds like the way things work in the countryside when folk are on your side.
We've had high winds uproot sugi trees near our place, so I would be wary of building in the range of any exposed ones. Or anything hard to replace, such as fruit trees that will take ten years to re-establish. If you're high up, snow on the crown can also snap sugis pretty easily. I've seen it happen to trees that are 50cm in diameter.
The cost of permaculture courses is a thorny one and is certainly not limited to Japan. I would only do one on personal recommendation from another student. If you get a teacher who has years of actual experience and who puts in way over the stated hours in advice, followup, and encouragement, they look like good value, even at the typical price of approaching 1000USD. Conversely, there are teachers who've simply taken the courses, read the books, and actually tried only the simplest of the techniques. Those are the ones to avoid.
dataGecko
2010-04-24, 09:31 PM
Hey Gecko. Many thanks for the greets and for sorting me out on BlackSheep too. Lots of catching up to do :D
I'll send you YahooMap co-ords for the plot in a moment, but should reply to this post first.
So, you're in Oz but thinking to move over here? Is that right? J partner, I presume. Cool.
Thanks, pm'ed you about that one. Yea, we are in Oz, and the J wife is keen to be back in Japan one day (though ideally a place here and a place there would be sweet, but the budget is not likely to allow that. Dreamin'!) I've done a few trips, but never lived in Japan, so there is a lot that is unknown to me, though the guys on the board here have been fantastic with helping out on that. I was lucky to visit a few of the guys on our last trip too. We are starting to plan the next one, and it could be the end of this year, and if I can swing it, a longer stay - maybe 2 to 3 months. Be great to catch up if you'd like to?
The area I'm hopefully going to be setting up in (waiting to hear back from the Nogyou Inkai) is in Sho-o-cho. It's a beautiful place, 10 mins from the Mimasaka IC on the Chugoku-do, and an hour and a half's drive from the Kanjo-sen (loop) in Osaka. There's a bunch of viable but un-used farm land in the vicinity, and if the intentional community idea is still of interest, it would be an excellent place to consider setting it up.
Sho-o-cho is one of the few districts in Okayama that is operating in the black, mainly thanks to the taxes paid by several large manufacturers with plants there. Despite the industrial infrastructure, the district is large enough that in most places you'd never guess that it had any industry at all. Land here is very well priced, with san-rin going way cheaper than agricultural land. 10 acres (http://www.inaka-gurashi.co.jp/content/view/567/125/) for 580万円 anyone?
Ahh, I did the train trip from Tsuyama to Sayoo on my last trip to visit another board member in that region. Yea, its pretty though there, though they did get that huge rain that made a bit of a mess of the place last year. Also I've been warned to be aware of contaminated land where factories have dumped their waste, apparently its a big problem in the countryside, though I have no idea where exactly.
Yea, some good value land around, which is encouraging given how ridiculous it is here.
Your WWOOFing sounds cool, but I'm also surprised by the no fencing idea. I'll be putting up electric fences until I get a good hedge established, that's for sure. Antweasle's pic looks likely to be a nightly occurrence there.
( take a look at this vid (http://www.contech-inc.com/bear.avi) and see what made the bear jump here (http://www.contech-inc.com/products/scarecrow/). There's a Japanese distributor (http://www.yuukoumarine.jp/contech/contech.htm) too. What d'ya think?)
Yea, I know, we have a battle with the possums here in town, and the wild hares and roos you'd think would wipe them out, but... they don't. And its not like they are not around. I saw a big wild hare on my first night there, and asked about it, and they said there is a family that lives on the property, but they go next door to feed! Its quite remarkable. Even the bush turkeys don't seem to do much. I saw a couple of small scratched up areas, but considering how much mulch is about I thought they'd be a real pest. Go figure. I don't think it would work in Japan though with the deer and wild pigs. :-) I'd go with a fence. :-)
dataGecko
2010-04-24, 09:47 PM
gomu- apple-ologies if this is going off topic!
Can't beat hands-on experience, ay mate? Love to hear of any other unique ideas you and the Missus picked up.
I'd be quite amazed as well that 'roos, etc. left the veggies alone. Then again, as the PNG people say, "the only pest critters are hungry critters". Actually, they don't say that at all, but that's what me Olde Dad translated from pidgeon after living there a few years. Throw a few sweet potatoes over the fence and everyone's happy.
Photo of a culprit taken on a game camera rooting my veggie garden:
Hope he didn't do too much damage!! Yup, surprised us too.
Hands on experience is what we desperately need. :-) Hopeless we are, but that just means we've got lots of scope for learnin'. :-) It was only a short stay though, so not much else learnt, except that cobblers pegs (a prolific local weed) is a sure sign of calcium deficiency. We spent one day clearing a neglected orchard by hand of 6 foot tall cobblers pegs, and then limed the area generously around the trees. These weeds though do pull up a lot of good nutrients from the soil, so they make great mulch.
Also leaned that 4 solid hours of manual labour without a break is a good workout. ;-) haha
dataGecko
2010-04-24, 10:02 PM
Quite right. That's why I only bought an acre. It's meant as a "door opener", the valley we chose seems to have 40~50% of the land abandoned or not being actively farmed and hopefully, little by little we'll be able to expand our plot.
Sounds like a sound plan. Yea, the hardest part is getting access to someone happy to sell without going through the agents. We've looked at a few places though www.inaka-gurashi.co.jp but they don't seem real keen to help out much. Not sure if this is just the gaijin factor at work, could be I guess. We looked seriously at one place last trip, but didn't buy it, and I think they've now marked us as too much trouble. :rolleyes:
myhobbyis
2010-04-24, 11:48 PM
Sounds like a sound plan. Yea, the hardest part is getting access to someone happy to sell without going through the agents. We've looked at a few places though www.inaka-gurashi.co.jp but they don't seem real keen to help out much. Not sure if this is just the gaijin factor at work, could be I guess. We looked seriously at one place last trip, but didn't buy it, and I think they've now marked us as too much trouble. :rolleyes:
DG,
I guess it could be 'gaijinfactor' but the country estate agents we dealt with seemed to quite often have us strange country loving ex-pat types for customers.
However unlike the urban estate agents who can get a fast turn over of properties with little effort I think the country cousin estate agents have to do a lot with little return in profit so we came across a few who were very nonchalant because they could see it was going to be a hard road to handing over the keys to us. :p
As you say that may be what's going on.
Actually, I've had no trouble with any of the fudosan yet, but I got shy of one whose ads didn't describe what they were selling accurately. Web info and info on the phone didn't match up, that sort of thing. The www.inaka-gurashi.co.jp folks are the ones we're buying from in fact. One thing I always do is ask to talk to the shacho. The underlings never have enough authority (and rarely have the gumption) to think about what I want more than what the company wants to sell. Shachos love being called "daredare shacho" by a foreigner. Goodness knows why, but I almost always get tip top service when I deal with them directly. Even had a couple of free lunches with one fella.
dataGecko
2010-04-25, 06:51 AM
Actually, I've had no trouble with any of the fudosan yet, but I got shy of one whose ads didn't describe what they were selling accurately. Web info and info on the phone didn't match up, that sort of thing. The www.inaka-gurashi.co.jp folks are the ones we're buying from in fact. One thing I always do is ask to talk to the shacho. The underlings never have enough authority (and rarely have the gumption) to think about what I want more than what the company wants to sell. Shachos love being called "daredare shacho" by a foreigner. Goodness knows why, but I almost always get tip top service when I deal with them directly. Even had a couple of free lunches with one fella.
Snap.... we spoke to that Shacho last time too actually, and while he was better to deal with, I think my lack of Japanese was a real barrier. I know he speaks English, and can certainly understand, but I found he was very reluctant to do so, and thus the whole conversation went though my wife, and while she is pretty good with this sort of thing, I guess I just felt very sidelined by the whole process, which is a bit hard when its a huge decision you are working on.... And you are use to being in control of these things. :o He was a nice guy though.
Not sure if they want to see us again though. We dragged them out to see this place three times last trip, and I think they thought it was in the bag and were a bit peeved when we didn't proceed. Oh well, its only like our whole life, but I know they struggle to make a sale too, so I kinda understand. Just you have to go though them for everything, they didn't want us snooping around ourselves. Oh well, live and learn.
shonanfred
2010-04-25, 08:24 AM
Hey guys...
Another sailor (1959 Nordic Folkboat) here...looking to buy some land in the country.
You'll see me here again soon!
Fred
Hey Fred. Welcome to the forum. A Folkboat? Here in Japan? Blimey, who'd a thunk it.
myhobbyis
2010-04-25, 08:37 PM
Hey guys...
Another sailor (1959 Nordic Folkboat) here...
You'll see me here again soon!
Fred
Welcome Fred,
Any chance of seeing that boat on the main thread or elsewhere ? I'm quite interested in building a little nordic sailing boat sometime.
Good luck with the property searching, hope we can be of help or just chew the fat.
shonanfred
2010-04-25, 08:48 PM
Wish it was here - only able to sail it in August....have to make do with plastic here in Shonan.
Fred
Here are some pictures:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/40735228@N03/3750816194/
Here are some pictures:
Man, they're sweet little boats, eh. There's nothing quite like the sound of a clinker built boat slipping gently through the barely stirring summer waters...
Arrrgh! I'm landlocked!
[We apologize for the interference, Gomu is re-adjusting his priorities as we speak]
Wish me luck! Off for an interview with the Nogyou Inkai kaichou first thing tomorrow. Last barrier between me and the land!
Oh, and an update. Decided to get a Yurt to live in while building the house. Settled on the ones by ColoradoYurt.com in case anyone's interested. Also decided on a composting toilet (http://www.envirolet.com/enlowwatrems6.html) as the missus has bad memories of the kumitori ones and wouldn't be persuaded...
Inaka Bryan
2010-05-08, 05:04 AM
Also decided on a composting toilet (http://www.envirolet.com/enlowwatrems6.html) as the missus has bad memories of the kumitori ones and wouldn't be persuaded...
Gomu;
The house we have our eye on has a pit latrine. My plan was to fill that in and build a DIY composting toilet and compost the humanure:
http://www.scribd.com/doc/270721/Humanure-Handbook
kirinclassic
2010-05-08, 10:03 AM
[QUOTE=gomu;959812]Wish me luck! Off for an interview with the Nogyou Inkai kaichou first thing tomorrow. Last barrier between me and the land!
QUOTE]
Good luck!
Cheers,
KC
Well, the interview with the Nogyou inkai is over and done with. I get the impression that the district we're hoping to move into is about as strict as they come. I think I mentioned earlier that the chou had successfully resisted being swallowed up by their nearest city a couple of years back, and that as a result they were proud as hell about their new found independence.
The inkai was represented by the kai-cho and three senior members, and we had our notary (forgotten the Japanese word for it, a kind of lawyer) with us.
The interview was a fairly weird experience, the notary had told us to not go into any details that weren't brought up directly by the inkai, and so I spent most of my time biting my tongue. I wish he hadn't said that as it made me very self concious.
To be fair to the inkai, the kaicho and one of the members seemed unphazed by my foreignness but keen to establish that we weren't religious nuts or dope fiends, a perfectly understandable stance imo. One of the other interviewers, probably the oldest, certainly the saltiest looking, was full of intelligent questions about permaculture, seed saving and how we intended to protect our crops against cross pollination with local non-heirloom/non-hybrid varieties. If he'd spoken with a less broad accent I would have understood a bunch more of what he was saying, but what I caught sounded very interesting. I'll have to look him out if we get our permission to move. Inevitably there was the obligatory a-hole too. Extremely defensive about his farm/the village's well being and skeptical if not downright hostile towards us and our ability to farm, I assigned him to the 'smile and ignore' pile and concentrated on the others.
One sweaty moment came about when the notary chimed in that we'd bought a Kominka in the neighbouring village, which was total bullshit and I've no idea where he got that idea from, so we had to explain that that wasn't the case and what our actual residential situation was. Something we'd managed to avoid talking about up until then. It made us look foolish and cast unnecessary doubt on the whole proceedings. What a pratt!
Anyway, it turns out that the only real reason they can use to reject our application is that they fear we might be up to no good. Whether our notion of agriculture matches theirs or not is neither here nor there. So maybe we'll be ok.
The inkai reps we met yesterday will now take their findings to the whole inkai which convenes on Monday and they'll make a recommendation to the chou following that.
Blimey, what a palaver!
johnElarue
2010-05-09, 02:20 PM
What a rigamarole, I'm sure you'll get approved , though. Did they ask you anything about the home you plan to build? Just wondering how the alternative construction methods would be viewed. Does your planned cordwood structure have a central post? Good choice with the yurt, should be interesting. Will you be going with a composting head? Sorry for all the questions.
john
What a rigamarole, I'm sure you'll get approved , though. Did they ask you anything about the home you plan to build? Just wondering how the alternative construction methods would be viewed. Does your planned cordwood structure have a central post? Good choice with the yurt, should be interesting. Will you be going with a composting head? Sorry for all the questions.
john
Hey John,
No, they didn't ask about the building. We've decided to build on the Genya area which, not being Nouchi, they have no jurisdiction over. We're considering buying 6000m of adjoining sanrin which our potential neighbour has just offered us at a silly price. The slope is fairly gentle and I'm keen if for no other reason than that it would supply us with a lifetime of firewood... it might be a better site for the house but I think we'll have to spend some time in the yurt before we decide where to build.
I was originally thinking to build a reciprocal roof which doesn't need any central support. I'm not so sure now having built a model and seen how a yurt roof works. I might just go for a paneled yurt style roof. Have you seen this site (http://www.mandalahomes.com/predesigned.php)? I reckon I could do one of them if I could get ahold of the plans... I still want to do cordwood walls upto the window sills, but the whole house idea is going to be fluid until we've spent a year on the land observing the seasons.
Toilets are definitely going to be composting. Take a look at the link I put up here (http://forum.gaijinpot.com/showthread.php?85548-re-cycled-building-materials-in-Okayama&p=959812&viewfull=1#post959812). We've ordered two (one for the yurt, one for the house) as it'll save on the shipping and there was a discount running to the end of April. They have a holding tank that apparently needs emptying only 3 or 4 times a year. The whole process is aerobic (dry) and therefore odorless and easy to empty. In theory, at least.
KenElwood
2010-05-09, 04:23 PM
Hey gomu, a big otsukare. Yeah, if yer not planning some big mary jane operation I'd think you'd be okay. :-)
Like the sound of yer tentative house plans. Will you be at the land full-time to start ? Or will you be transitioning ?
Cheers,
ken
Hey gomu, a big otsukare. Yeah, if yer not planning some big mary jane operation I'd think you'd be okay. :-)
Like the sound of yer tentative house plans. Will you be at the land full-time to start ? Or will you be transitioning ?
Cheers,
ken
Cheers for that, Ken.
I'll be staying on the land 5 days a week and staying in the city one night for two days of 'work' a week.
Figure that'll do me :)
Inaka Bryan
2010-05-10, 12:57 PM
Gomu,
Wow, what a process. Seems like for a country that is struggling to find people who want to practice agriculture they sure do try to erect enough red tape to discourage anyone with an interest. Sounds like you gotta face the politburo just to buy a little piece of land. What a load of _____ .
Anyway, much kuddos to you for jumping through the hoops and reporting on the experience. Thanks.
We wish you the best and hope it all goes well with the approval to buy...
IB
dataGecko
2010-05-10, 08:04 PM
Well done Gomu, I'm sure you have got it. Sounds much tougher then I would have imagined though!!! Good to hear the alternative building aspects didn't raise too much attention. :-)
karamatsu
2010-05-11, 12:58 PM
Fingers crossed for you gomu. Great to hear what is involved.
When you get your yurt, make sure you get the most mould resistant one! I know someone who lives in one that is very manky, though it is in the shade and surrounded by trees. Mongolia is a high desert, so its very different to Japan.
freeB
2010-05-11, 02:02 PM
I just caught up with this thread and I'm pretty speechless..... Really, I'm speechless. I'm just speechless. Hope all goes well gomu!!!
dataGecko
2010-05-11, 09:19 PM
DG,
I guess it could be 'gaijinfactor' but the country estate agents we dealt with seemed to quite often have us strange country loving ex-pat types for customers.
However unlike the urban estate agents who can get a fast turn over of properties with little effort I think the country cousin estate agents have to do a lot with little return in profit so we came across a few who were very nonchalant because they could see it was going to be a hard road to handing over the keys to us. :p
As you say that may be what's going on.
Yup, that sounds about right. We are not easy customers I guess cause there is so much we don't know, so its lots and lots of questions that must seem pretty stupid to them. :-)
Hey all! I'm back from sunny Dorset (http://www.out-of-the-blue.info/uploads/webphoto/photos/a00088a4c10d39fe47ee.jpg), refreshed and ready to start applying myself to the land in earnest now.
While we were away, the nogyou inkai saw fit to let our application proceed, and all that remains is to go and pay the money. Once that's done, the land 'is ours' (lol. phrase brings back memories of the UK (http://www.tlio.org.uk/)...), and once that's done the real work begins!
If anyone's in the Okayama area at weekends, I'd be glad of the company. Just send me a mail and I'll tell you how to get there.
Bring wellies!
julian s
2010-06-14, 02:14 PM
Hey all! I'm back ...... refreshed and ready to start applying myself to the land in earnest now.
While we were away, the nogyou inkai saw fit to let our application proceed....
That's great news. Congratulations! It's going to be quite a challenge, all that land, but you seem well-prepared.
Looking forward to following your progress. From afar!
Julian
kirinclassic
2010-06-14, 07:09 PM
Congrats, gomu, you must be over the moon. Hope to make it to your teepee someday.
Cheers,
KC
KenElwood
2010-06-14, 09:01 PM
gomu, welcome back and omedetou !
a panorama taken from roughly the middle of the plot:
http://out-of-the-blue.info/images/misc/guibiPanorama1.jpg
A pre-otsukare to you. I've been fiddling around with a handful of projects for the past year on a fraction of the amount of land yer now on, and i'm physically worn-out... Anyway, please do keep us posted on some of yer projects at the land there. :-)
ken
Stuffguy
2010-06-14, 10:32 PM
Many kudos.. I'm here on the expat gig at the moment, and I'm hesitant to give that up, but I'll be applying for my PR shortly, and have dreams of moving to the country, and just grow stuff for a living. Twould sure beat automotive. :)
Anyhow.. Thanks for letting me live vicariously. My wife has some aging relatives that already offered their farms, if I'd farm them. Wife is unsure, but sure sounds tempting. :)
Anyhow.. Thanks again, and I wish you the best of luck!
Cheers!
yes, gomu! big congrats!!! it must be quite a relief (and a bit of a scare) to have gotten the green light. may the adventure begin!
i've been reading a bit about sepp holzer lately. he's got some good ideas similar to the permaculture camp but relate to earthworks and large areas. maybe something of use for your land? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mzRzJRiUylg&feature=related
johnElarue
2010-06-15, 08:18 AM
If anyone's in the Okayama area at weekends, I'd be glad of the company. Just send me a mail and I'll tell you how to get there.
Bring wellies!
Congrats gomu and thanks for the invite,
I'm not too far and am willing to help (learn) with some cordwood masonry when the time comes.
john