Family of 4 on 270,000 a month?

[radinsky]

I'm currently managing a family of 3 on that amount (spread over 2 jobs) but the next kid is along the way. Part of the house is paid off so my monthly bills are actually very cheap compared to renting an apartment, even a cheap one)

The numbers just don't add up to support a 2nd child, but I was in a much better position financially a couple years ago and things have been going from bad to worse every day on the job front.

Since I am at some kind of poverty level in the eyes of the town office, I get subsidies and tax breaks, etc. which really help save the day but I'm desperately looking to get out of this rut.

My job(s) are not too bad but the hours are very demanding and I'm working 7-day weeks. This would almost be workable but the constant strain on my body on the job and lack of sleep have worn me down to the point I'm ready to collapse.

Is there a good way out of this situation, or is there any other way I can get other financial aid? I'm doing my best to try and find other work in the time I have late at night/early morning but nothing is panning out.

[ume]

dude .. that sucks.

Im assuming your a guy, but how realistic is it for your wife to go back to work after the baby is born? You would probably be eligible for public hoikuen for both kids while she worked. Which would really take the strain off you?

Would it be worth trying to find ONE job that pays the same amount? I mean ... 2 jobs can kill you.

Also would your inlaws help out financially? Or with childcare? So your wife could work too? Even if its just a part time thing it could be the little extra you need to keep your head above water?

[radinsky]

We are eligible for public hoikuen but there is a really massive waiting list and lottery and that actually affects employment for at least one of the Mrs. or myself (what days/when we can work) since it could be anywhere in the city and we don't have a say where it will be (if they offer it, you have to take it because the waiting list was over 300 at the time we applied last year).

If we can secure a hoikuen then it might work out that the Mrs. can do weekday work, and that would help.

Yeah, one job that pays as much as I make would be a life saver. I have experience as a developer/engineer and some management roles as well as work with small children. Unfortunately I went through a phase of getting lots of Japanese certifications (JLPT 1kyu, JIPTA 2kyu, even Kanji Kentei) but translation and interpretation work seems so small and hard to find, and usually just part of the responsibilities of another job, and in the end that certification really hasn't helped me at all. At least it didn't put me in debt.

Unfortunately with my side of the family abroad they can not provide much help (they are financially no better off than I am) and the other side of the family is getting on in years and can't help that much themselves for other reasons of health and fatigue. Once in a while they do help on a weekend for a day and that is actually when I get my sleep for the week.

Yeah, I guess if we can secure hoikuen this year, things will be more manageable, but it really seems like I'm in an endless uphill battle and I'm worried for my family that I'm going to just give out and collapse one of these days.

[TJrandom]

Are you in a job/company/industry that will permit you to move up in the coming years – or is your job more or less dead-end? If dead-end, you should start looking for a better job – even if it does not initially pay more. Over time, your income should rise and carry you out of this situation – but it won’t do that if you don’t choose a career path correctly.

[ttokyo]

First, congratulations on your next kid. Actually costs are sharply going down from the second one. My younger son usally gets the used stuff from the older one.

a) For working your 'rear end off', the salary seems pitiful. Even Eikaiwa would pay in that range without collapsing. So have all other efforts to find other employment failed ? Even our (bilingual) secretary gets that amount for 9-5 job. With a proper visa, I-kyu and some work experience, I'd expect that a small gaishikei would hire you for Y 300-350k for general office work, especially if you know IT.
b) What are your long-term plans ? If your outlook does not get better, are you considering to go back into your home country, especially regarding free schooling, lower cost of living and better social support ? I am always crossing my fingers, how long the current 'good life' will last and expect to return to Europe if I have to pay housing/school fees myself.

[Agitator]

We are eligible for public hoikuen but there is a really massive waiting list and lottery and that actually affects employment for at least one of the Mrs. or myself (what days/when we can work) since it could be anywhere in the city and we don't have a say where it will be (if they offer it, you have to take it because the waiting list was over 300 at the time we applied last year).

If we can secure a hoikuen then it might work out that the Mrs. can do weekday work, and that would help.

Ah, Japan... land of good support for working mothers. "How dare you try to go against The System! Your wife should be at home all day taking care of those kids! Submit feeble woman!" All I can say on this one is, good luck. I hope you get a slot but I wouldn't hold my breath.

Yeah, one job that pays as much as I make would be a life saver. I have experience as a developer/engineer and some management roles as well as work with small children. Unfortunately I went through a phase of getting lots of Japanese certifications (JLPT 1kyu, JIPTA 2kyu, even Kanji Kentei) but translation and interpretation work seems so small and hard to find, and usually just part of the responsibilities of another job, and in the end that certification really hasn't helped me at all. At least it didn't put me in debt.

Do you have a degree? In Engineering?

Where are you at, by the way?

The answers are Yes/Yes/Tokyo, I would think that you can do better than 270,000 a month, even in this crappy economy. The Japense certifications might in some way be beneficial but I doubt they'll ever put any actual money in your pocket.

Yeah, I guess if we can secure hoikuen this year, things will be more manageable, but it really seems like I'm in an endless uphill battle and I'm worried for my family that I'm going to just give out and collapse one of these days.

Ah, Japan. All that good quality of life! Where everyone is middle class... (Yes, my sarcas-o-meter is off the charts today.)

Encouragingly,
A.

[YokohamaTommy]

It might help (and help others) if you could provide a breakdown of your monthly expenses,
so you can see where the waste may be.

* Another thing if your wife is wanting to stay home with the children, is perhaps an internet-based business.

* Write an e-book.

* Visit an antique shop and buy and sell unusual items over the internet.

* Be observant; Talk to people. Take every opportunity you never know who you might meet.

[crazy1]

As mentioned above, a breakdown of costs would be helpful. I don't think 270 a month is impossible to live on, but it certainly won't allow luxuries like a car or shopping trips. Many Japanese support families on much less than that. I have a feeling the wife is the typical Japanese type who doesn't want to work and just wants to be a shuufu forever. That's just not fair on you, and she can say it's tough with 2 kids, blah, blah, but reality is that most women work in western countries, and those who don't have really s-hitty lifestyles. (and yes, I'm female and the working type, and I will still work even if I have kids)
Have you thought about giving up the 2nd job and starting your own eikaiwa? She could help with that, and it could give you the extra income that's needed, especially if you can start off from home. At this pace, you are headed for a breakdown, and there will be nobody to pay the bills if you can't work.
What part of japan are you in?


Oh, and a quick scan of teaching jobs (well in Osaka) seems to be around 240,000yen a month for 5 days. If you are working 7 days a week and only getting 270 a month, I think it's time to look for a new job. I think if you have experience you could get 270 for 5 days a week.
And how about that family allowance thing for kids? Isn't it 13,000yen a month per kid? So your income should be almost 300,000 when the baby is born. that's pretty good money.

[YokohamaTommy]

(and I will still work even if I have kids)

But just remember, with two incomes, you have to factor in day-care, work clothes, haircuts, extra car payments/insurance/gasoline, extra food for lunches, money spent on fast food because both spouses were too tired to cook or shop, etc.
In some cases, depending on the job salary potential, a family actually may have a net gain ratio that is less than if one spouse stayed home.

And who in this case is the primary caregiver? A professional? Is that healthy for young children if Mommy and Daddy are exhausted when they come home?
How about exhausted for each other? Relationships take work and energy, right? Where's the time?
Physical exercise as well?
I'm not saying it cannot or should not be done, some people just have a need to work outside the home.
But often I think there's a sort of fooling of ourselves in some instances with this regard.

For example, in America, there's this sort of disdain created by the backlash of the 1960's women's liberation movement that somehow being a stay at home Mother was belittling or a "waste of a woman's potential" or some lines along that.

You always hear "You need two incomes to survive" as a mantra here in the states.
Two incomes for what? That overpriced house in the suburbs? Paying a gardener or a maid?
Buying the latest garbage from the mall, only to toss it out 3 months later when the new one comes out?
Eating overpriced, unhealthy prepackaged crap? Having cable TV and phone data plans that cost more per month than what most of the world earns in a year?
What's the real point of both spouses working to support a house where no one is ever home?
Or more importantly, no quality of life for your family?
In this case, what is quality of life?

[thefg]

I have experience as a developer/engineer and some management roles as well as work with small children. Unfortunately I went through a phase of getting lots of Japanese certifications (JLPT 1kyu, JIPTA 2kyu, even Kanji Kentei) but translation and interpretation work seems so small and hard to find,

I know a company who is currently looking for someone with a mechanical or engineering background to manage a team of experts for a car insurance company. The ideal candidate needs to speak Business Japanese and English

[underling]

Congrats on your new baby.

When i read this I was like, WTF. I've never ever been offered a job with less than atleast 5-6M per year, I do not have JLPT 1kyuu, maybe like 1.5kyuu? Though seems almost completely irrelevant.
Finding a job with more than 3M per month must be a walk in the park, especially if you know english/japanese that well and are in the IT business. Have you tried ______.com, they seem to have tons of position with higher salary than 3M that are not very qualified even, translations jobs etc. Like someone said most secretary jobs are better paid. Maybe I'm blunt but I dont see how this is a problem for you, especially with the hours you put in. Is the problem that you keep failing at interviews or what goes wrong?

Hope everything works out well - best of luck☆

I forgot to ask, what type of education do you have besides japanese 1kyuu?

[Hijinx]

270,000? That would cover my booze bill.

[rich dude kryptonite]

In this case, what is quality of life?

Quality of life is both parents contributing. Quality of life is having a good role model for daughters. Quality of life is having a mother who gets to step out of the bully/housewife/PTA cycle. Quality of life is a family paying their fair share of taxes instead of stealing from others to support an unemployed woman. Quality of life is having something to fall back on in case of death/divorce. Quality of life is a mother with skills. Quality of life is having a life that continues after your kids are out of the house.

Being a working mother in this country is hard, but the worst part of it is when people like you treat the people paying taxes so that unemployed wives can get free pensions and not have to pay their own fair share of taxes like pariahs.

[radinsky]

Okay, I'll give a brief answer to a few of the questions:

Are you in a job/company/industry that will permit you to move up in the coming years – or is your job more or less dead-end? If dead-end, you should start looking for a better job – even if it does not initially pay more. Over time, your income should rise and carry you out of this situation – but it won’t do that if you don’t choose a career path correctly.

One of them is dead end for sure, but it is only a handful of hours per week and it does add a few extra yen with minimal effort. The other has some room for improvement salary-wise and might make the two jobs redundant in the long run but progress is slow on that front. I have been poking around the job markets (IT as well as education/nursery), but the entry salaries offered are comparatively low and I wouldn't want to take a dip in income at this time. I have connections and former colleagues that have also been poking around on my behalf, but nothing has panned out.

Congrats on your new baby.

Thanks to all of you who have made this statement. We are looking forward to the new arrival despite of the less than stellar financial situation.

Maybe I'm blunt but I dont see how this is a problem for you, especially with the hours you put in. Is the problem that you keep failing at interviews or what goes wrong?

Part of it is my age, and part of it is due to the changing job fields in which I have worked over the years. They see me as the jack of all trades (which isn't a bad thing depending on the company and the job responsibilities). Still another part of it is location. I own land and a house and my location is fixed so unless the offer is really good (and I haven't had anything like that), I can't justify an extremely long (2.5+ hour) commute to work to make less than what I do now, and moving is out of the question with such a low bill each month on the house loan. Sometimes the interview goes awry but that is not usually the case. However, sometimes the job position is very clearly stated to be a temporary position and they are behind schedule and need bodies fast to put in insane overtime to finish everything as soon as possible...and then you're cut. K**I and H*****i tend to do this a lot, I notice.

With IT jobs, if I get my foot in the door, I'm fine, and to be honest I have been asked to do a few very small contracted projects over the years, but after they are soon over there has been no more work, so it is always back to square one. I think I'm just not hitting the sweet spots in the job market or I'm just not sure where to strike.

Oh, and about other education (apart from translation/interpretation certification and the arguably useless kanji kentei), I have a software engineering degree.

I know a company who is currently looking for someone with a mechanical or engineering background to manage a team of experts for a car insurance company. The ideal candidate needs to speak Business Japanese and English

I would be very interested in pursuing this. If it isn't too much trouble would you like to get in touch with me through private messages?

And how about that family allowance thing for kids? Isn't it 13,000yen a month per kid? So your income should be almost 300,000 when the baby is born. that's pretty good money.

Yes, and it is because of reasons like this that we can survive and make all the basic bills. We don't have much for anything extra, but that is still fine for the moment. Also, if your income is very low, in some cities like mine, the town office covers part of the hoikuen expenses and covers medical costs up to some arbitrary age (I believe it is around Junior High School age here)

And on the last point (God, I hope the user base here has more brain cells overall than at bigdaikon)

What the f&ck is there to congrat?? I mean it ain't like it was hard (except on the night )

The dimwit reproduced again when he can't even support the brood he's got now. You don't congrat stupidity and irresponsibility where I come from. He'll be claiming benefits, I guess...

Wow, you are a complete piece of human garbage. Guess what, idiot? I *am* supporting my kid. I can't afford extras but I can cover the basic expenses. I have minimal support but even then I won't be in any foreseeable danger to have to take my family to the streets (it will just be tight and I may have to cut back further on food and gas, electricity, etc.). Things change, companies go under, and promises at work go broken as buyouts and takeovers happen. You just have to deal with it. Your statement about having children being nothing to congratulate? What are you, 16? Having children is not trivial when you get older, and though the stats vary depending on source, approx. 10~15 percent of married couples are unable to have children. I have nothing more to say to the likes of garbage like you.

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[crazy1]

you said your house loan is low, and you live outside the big cities, surely your monthly expenses are low? With loan mortgage payments, room to grow some vegies (and fruit trees...?) that should surely bring down the monthly bills...

[crazy1]

But just remember, with two incomes, you have to factor in day-care, work clothes, haircuts, extra car payments/insurance/gasoline, extra food for lunches, money spent on fast food because both spouses were too tired to cook or shop, etc.
In some cases, depending on the job salary potential, a family actually may have a net gain ratio that is less than if one spouse stayed home.

And who in this case is the primary caregiver? A professional? Is that healthy for young children if Mommy and Daddy are exhausted when they come home?
How about exhausted for each other? Relationships take work and energy, right? Where's the time?
Physical exercise as well?
I'm not saying it cannot or should not be done, some people just have a need to work outside the home.
But often I think there's a sort of fooling of ourselves in some instances with this regard.

For example, in America, there's this sort of disdain created by the backlash of the 1960's women's liberation movement that somehow being a stay at home Mother was belittling or a "waste of a woman's potential" or some lines along that.

You always hear "You need two incomes to survive" as a mantra here in the states.
Two incomes for what? That overpriced house in the suburbs? Paying a gardener or a maid?
Buying the latest garbage from the mall, only to toss it out 3 months later when the new one comes out?
Eating overpriced, unhealthy prepackaged crap? Having cable TV and phone data plans that cost more per month than what most of the world earns in a year?
What's the real point of both spouses working to support a house where no one is ever home?
Or more importantly, no quality of life for your family?
In this case, what is quality of life?

Agree with pretty everything you said here. I applaud mothers who can stay at home, not go insane, and be happy to not help out with monthly bills. But as someone else said, both spouses working help towards a better economy, pay taxes to help those who can't work etc. I think if the non-working spouse has skills, then it's crazy to put those to waste by staying home. Of course if she has no skills, and is happy to stay at home, then why not....that's the case with many people in countries like Australia that encourage mothers to stay home (and pay them quite well to do so), and where childcare is quite high so working is not really a good option. But in Japan it's much cheaper so I think it's more viable to work, but Japanese women just don't want to work. That's the problem.


My reason for wanting to still work when I get married and have kids is that I watched my mother (who was/is a bit of deadbeat with no skills anyway) sit home, day after day, while my dad was out working on a truck and gone for long periods at a time, while my mother sat at home with 5 kids to try and feed.

While everyone around her (including us children) wanted her to get even part time work to put food on the table (a rarity) my dad was the type that didn't (and still doesn't) believe in women working, he believes women don't need an education, should just stay home and take care of their husbands. He made fairly good money from his trucking company so we weren't eligible for Government benefits (he p-issed it all up at the local pub while his kids were at home virtually starving), So as we sat in our tiny Government provided house, with unpaid telephone bills and the power cut off, I swore that I would NEVER allow my future children to go through the same hardship as I did, which is why I work so hard now. But that's just me.

On the other hand my younger sister has 4 kids under 8, a husband on a low salary, so receives more money from the Australian Government to stay at home and sit on her fat a-rse than she would working (she has no skills, so would only get a s-hit job anyway and it would cost more for childcare than she'd make) so for her, she's better off doing that. Of course for the taxpayers that's not good though, but that's the crazy Australian Government to blame.


Anyway, back to the OP. I think the wife needs to pick up some hours at the local supermarket, he needs to cut back on the part time job, and maybe use the land he has for a home based business, or to help save money; like growing vegies.

[YokohamaTommy]

Quality of life is both parents contributing.

So then, a functioning house-wife/husband does not contribute to anything?
That's the myth I am referring to. I'm not speaking about house wife/husbands who chose that life because they are lazy and simply don't want to work.

Quality of life is having a good role model for daughters.

What does that have to do with the concept? That children see mom/dad as a homemaker, and that's a somehow a bad role model?
Children don't have bad role models because someone choses to work in the home. The have bad role models because some parents are simply a$$holes.

Quality of life is having a mother who gets to step out of the bully/housewife/PTA cycle.

Again, I'm not speaking about traditional roles or stereotypes or staying at home because one "is expected to."
I'm talking about examining what may be best for the entire family in some cases, emotionally, and financially. It could be the father, it could be the mother. The irony of course is, the paradigm shift (at least in many parts of America) is that if you don't have two parents working, you are somehow dysfunctional. So we've replaced simply one societal expectation for another.

Here's an extreme example:
Mom and Dad have two children and both work. The children have either a Nanny or Daycare workers as the primary care-giver all day.
Mom and Dad may work long hours and arrive home later in the day, or even at night.
Who makes dinner? When is there time for children? When is there time for each other?
Fast-forward 10 years. Kids eat breakfast by themselves, walk themselves to school, come home to an empty house, and the cycle repeats.
It happens every day in modern American households. Sure, they live in a nice pre-fab home, eat the best microwave dinners, and have the latest clothes and toys. But there's a cost to that. And ultimately, a cost to society.

Then take this example:
One parent stays home. You've saved on food, can prepare nutritious meals, save on caregiver service, have time to research investments and build that savings you talked about, keep your investment of a home in good repair, ensure that the parents know what is happening in their children's lives, and best of all, they won't be raised primarily by strangers.

So I think you are equating working in the home as some sort of prison, and it does not have to be that at all.
I think at that point, it boils down to the individual if that type of system can function or not.
There has to be an understood equality and appreciation which, because of the stereotypes you are talking about, is often a hard thing to do.

Quality of life is a family paying their fair share of taxes
instead of stealing from others to support an unemployed woman.

So again, I ask you; Your position is that homemakers are what...parasites on society?

Quality of life is having something to fall back on in case of death/divorce.

Quality of life is a mother with skills.

Quality of life is having a life that continues after your kids are out of the house.

I agree with you.
And I would argue that none of those things have to be tied with a choice for one parent to be a homemaker.
Again, I'm not speaking about expectations of being hair-in rollers housecoat and fuzzy slippers wearing PTA-nazi Shuufu.
I'm talking about two mature adults, co-operating to create a productive family household.
Look I definitely know where you are coming from.
You see all the housewives shuffling around, trapped in that role because society tells them that they have to, and you say, "To hell with that noise!"
And rightly so. It's degrading to women to be forced into such a role simply because society says it's "a woman's place."
But let me ask you a question:
If money was not an issue, would you spend more time at home or out an about with your children and husband, or would you hire a Nanny?
Would you prefer they are raised primarily by strangers, or by Mom and Dad?

My point is that there's a distinct difference between working because you need to survive and have a modicum of stability in an extremely expensive society,
and working simply because it is a source of identity and you wish to keep a certain lifestyle. Both courses have their pros and cons and costs in terms of our relationships with our spouses, children and overall health.

Being a working mother in this country is hard, but the worst part of it is when people like you treat the people paying taxes so that unemployed wives can get free pensions and not have to pay their own fair share of taxes like pariahs.

You are way off base here.

[Seattlegirl]

For example, in America, there's this sort of disdain created by the backlash of the 1960's women's liberation movement that somehow being a stay at home Mother was belittling or a "waste of a woman's potential" or some lines along that.

You always hear "You need two incomes to survive" as a mantra here in the states.

Although this is off-topic (post is regarding Japan, not the U.S.) I'm going to jump in here and disagree with you. I don't doubt that there are places where what you wrote is true, but in my experience, women who get to stay home with their kids are considered quite fortunate and envied by many women who work outside the home. I know MANY women who do not have employment outside the home. It's not necessarily a matter of having two incomes but having enough income. That doesn't necessarily mean that both parents leave the home to work.

I didn't want to work when my son was young but I didn't have a choice. It took a lot of maneuvering and sacrifice when he was in elementary school but I was able to have an income AND take him to school and pick him up every day AND volunteer a lot at the school. All that was on income I made from various jobs. No public assistance, no help from family in either country. My son will always remember that I was able to spend a lot of time with him and be at his school and still somehow manage rent and bills and entertainment, and he really appreciates it.

Also keep in mind that a lot of mothers who stay at home with their kid(s) are very unhappy and unsatisfied. The kids know this.

[thefg]

Quality of life is both parents contributing. Quality of life is having a good role model for daughters. Quality of life is having a mother who gets to step out of the bully/housewife/PTA cycle. Quality of life is a family paying their fair share of taxes instead of stealing from others to support an unemployed woman. Quality of life is having something to fall back on in case of death/divorce. Quality of life is a mother with skills. Quality of life is having a life that continues after your kids are out of the house.

Being a working mother in this country is hard, but the worst part of it is when people like you treat the people paying taxes so that unemployed wives can get free pensions and not have to pay their own fair share of taxes like pariahs.

BS.


That doesnt ensure quality of life.


Quality of life - if anything, is ensured by having choices. The choice to choose not to work is one such choice.

I agree with you on the tax issue, (again nothing to do with quality of life)


Your comment about stay at home mums being paranas is BS too.

People like you dont understand that stay at home mums ARE providing a social service - they are looking after our future engineers/doctors/workforce. Sure they could pass that responsibility to someone else (like a child care professional) but either way SOMEONE has to look after that child. Seams to me you dont think a stay at home mum is contributing to society in some way and thats just untrue.

[Tatsuo]

Why people respond honestly to a loser that can't live on 27万　in the country with little "rent" is beyond me.

There are people that live on less and have 5 kids. The problem is that stupid people are not good with money. That's about it.
The pure fact that this weirdo doesn't show us his housekeeping books shows that he knows exactly what the problem is: Unreasonable spending.

If he has almost no rent / installment and his wife is at home for what does he need money ?

The post of the OP reads like "I'm stupid what should I do ?"

[Super Grover]

I'm currently managing a family of 3 on that amount (spread over 2 jobs) but the next kid is along the way. Part of the house is paid off so my monthly bills are actually very cheap compared to renting an apartment, even a cheap one)

The numbers just don't add up to support a 2nd child, but I was in a much better position financially a couple years ago and things have been going from bad to worse every day on the job front.

Since I am at some kind of poverty level in the eyes of the town office, I get subsidies and tax breaks, etc. which really help save the day but I'm desperately looking to get out of this rut.

My job(s) are not too bad but the hours are very demanding and I'm working 7-day weeks. This would almost be workable but the constant strain on my body on the job and lack of sleep have worn me down to the point I'm ready to collapse.

Is there a good way out of this situation, or is there any other way I can get other financial aid? I'm doing my best to try and find other work in the time I have late at night/early morning but nothing is panning out.

I agree with Tatsuo and Harry in part, but without the vitriol/nastiness. But, damn, my taxes are paying for you and your family. That also sucks! The reason so many people in Japan do not marry or have children these days is because, as they say, they cannot afford to. Maybe your wife can find an online/home business that she can do.

[apeman]

I agree with Tatsuo and Harry in part, but without the vitriol/nastiness. But, damn, my taxes are paying for you and your family. That also sucks! The reason so many people in Japan do not marry or have children these days is because, as they say, they cannot afford to. Maybe your wife can find an online/home business that she can do.

I agree with this too. The OP clearly stated that he was in a better financial position 2 years ago and that things have been going from bad to worse. He says he's at the poverty level and can't make ends meet now. Why on earth would someone in this position decide to have another child at this time? A tough situation, but one of his own making. Simple solution: don't have kids you can't afford, or look for a job that will pay enough for you to support them.

[YokohamaTommy]

Although this is off-topic (post is regarding Japan, not the U.S.) I'm going to jump in here and disagree with you. I don't doubt that there are places where what you wrote is true, but in my experience, women who get to stay home with their kids are considered quite fortunate and envied by many women who work outside the home. I know MANY women who do not have employment outside the home. It's not necessarily a matter of having two incomes but having enough income. That doesn't necessarily mean that both parents leave the home to work.

I agree. However to be fair, the crux of my statement was regarding one spouse at home as a matter of overall family benefit.
And you are also correct about it not being the right lifestyle for everyone. Both parties must be willing, and considered, and it should also be about benefit for everyone in the family.
There's no use in having one spouse stay home if they are miserable.
I think perhaps this is where rich dude kryptonite may be coming from. I believe that no one can judge the sacrifices that many single parents make every day for their children.
I suppose the point is to look beyond transitional roles and do what makes sense for the family as a whole, examine the choices available, and not stand on egotism.

[Agitator]

Being a working mother in this country is hard, but the worst part of it is when people like you treat the people paying taxes so that unemployed wives can get free pensions and not have to pay their own fair share of taxes like pariahs.

I'll bet I paid way more in income taxes last year than you did. By your definition, you're a worthless parasite.

Scornfully,
A.

P.S. You probably are a parasite.

[Agitator]

Perhaps we could start an Engrish school together, or something....

I love the world in which teaching at or operating English schools is considered a pinnacle of success.

Disdainfully,
A.

[crazy1]

I'll bet I paid way more in income taxes last year than you did. By your definition, you're a worthless parasite.

Scornfully,
A.

P.S. You probably are a parasite.

how is she a worthless parasite when she's working in order to provide a better future for her kids (eg. being able to send them to college), and is contributing to the economy? Even if she paid 100yen in taxes it's more than someone who was at home looking after their kids did. She chooses to work, so why are you being so anal?

[radinsky]

Okay, I've got good news now. But since I am being misread, I'll explain it to avoid confusion.

The numbers just don't add up to support a 2nd child, but I was in a much better position financially a couple years ago and things have been going from bad to worse every day on the job front

The two parts aren't fully linked. The job conditions have been going from bad to worse but I have still had some financial success in the middle of that. Before we found out about the 2nd kid, I was working a contracted position that was looking promising, we finished it early and even received a fair bonus and then just as we were working on a few new projects, the company (an IT startup) just shut down. The biggest problem was that the income was uneven with a burst of money, then none at all; the 2nd kid happened somewhere along the upswing before things took another dip, none of which was foreseen and in retrospect I'm still not sure why the boss did that. To the crack about family planning and "don't have kids you can't afford", we could afford them from all the signs we had, but conception->birth takes 9 months and a lot can happen in that span. We are getting on in age and have always wanted children. It was a risk but one we both decided to take.

To all of you that don't like it that your taxes cover the subsidies I get, tough. I don't like to take it and would like a better lot, but here is the good news.

After the initial posting I got a few messages about various positions and ended up bagging an interview and just got an offer tonight substantially higher (not up to 500k/month, but over 400k anyways) so I'd like to extend a big middle finger to all the haters. Things may finally be looking up. A big thank you to all those that helped.

Oh, and on the "bad with money" bit, my wife was hospitalized and mother in law passed away and that takes money. Go f*ck yourself. Without that, after deductions to my base salary, health insurance, income tax, etc. (brings it down to under 220k), loan payment, food, utilities, clothes, transportation (not covered), I ended up with about 3~4man. That is enough from month to month but whenever there is an emergency it goes away fast. A nursery on that for my son might be covered to the point where 3~4 might have been enough. HOWEVER, even with all that I do think I could have shaved another 10,000 (well in theory 10,000) off a month after some study.

Yeah, this is the last time I think I need to post on this.

My original post was about trying to improve my lot financially so I wasn't living on the fringe. After studying it again, it isn't completely unlivable and even with a new mouth to feed things might have worked out, but it is always stressful when your sources of income don't pay much and the conditions have you running around 7-days a week. Anyways, what is done is done. Have fun you crazy cats.

[crazy1]

I agree. However to be fair, the crux of my statement was regarding one spouse at home as a matter of overall family benefit.
And you are also correct about it not being the right lifestyle for everyone. Both parties must be willing, and considered, and it should also be about benefit for everyone in the family.
There's no use in having one spouse stay home if they are miserable.
I think perhaps this is where rich dude kryptonite may be coming from. I believe that no one can judge the sacrifices that many single parents make every day for their children.
I suppose the point is to look beyond transitional roles and do what makes sense for the family as a whole, examine the choices available, and not stand on egotism.

In many countries (especially thesedays) being a stay at home mom is just not an option financially. My friend is a childcare manager in Australia and she says that more than 80% of the moms who send their kids there don't want to work, and that kid numbers have greatly increased in the past few years. It's almost impossible to live on one salary in Australia (unless of course it's that of a lawyer or doctor) so the mom has to work to pay bills. An average mortgage is about $2000 a month on a s-hitty 3 bedroom shack in the suburbs (that same house was about $800 a month 10 years ago) and given that the average Joe only makes $3000 a month after taxes, it doesn't leave much for other bills. So the wife either works or picks up family benefits from the Government.

In Japan living costs are much lower, especially for the OP. 270,000yen a month with a low mortage repayment (I assume around 50,000yen a month, he's yet to elaborate on that) so I find it highly unlikely that he should struggle on that amount...

[crazy1]

Okay, I've got good news now. But since I am being misread, I'll explain it to avoid confusion.



The two parts aren't fully linked. The job conditions have been going from bad to worse but I have still had some financial success in the middle of that. Before we found out about the 2nd kid, I was working a contracted position that was looking promising, we finished it early and even received a fair bonus and then just as we were working on a few new projects, the company (an IT startup) just shut down. The biggest problem was that the income was uneven with a burst of money, then none at all; the 2nd kid happened somewhere along the upswing before things took another dip, none of which was foreseen and in retrospect I'm still not sure why the boss did that. To the crack about family planning and "don't have kids you can't afford", we could afford them from all the signs we had, but conception->birth takes 9 months and a lot can happen in that span. We are getting on in age and have always wanted children. It was a risk but one we both decided to take.

To all of you that don't like it that your taxes cover the subsidies I get, tough. I don't like to take it and would like a better lot, but here is the good news.

After the initial posting I got a few messages about various positions and ended up bagging an interview and just got an offer tonight substantially higher (not up to 500k/month, but over 400k anyways) so I'd like to extend a big middle finger to all the haters. Things may finally be looking up. A big thank you to all those that helped.

Oh, and on the "bad with money" bit, my wife was hospitalized and mother in law passed away and that takes money. Go f*ck yourself. Without that, after deductions to my base salary, health insurance, income tax, etc. (brings it down to under 220k), loan payment, food, utilities, clothes, transportation (not covered), I ended up with about 3~4man. That is enough from month to month but whenever there is an emergency it goes away fast. A nursery on that for my son might be covered to the point where 3~4 might have been enough. HOWEVER, even with all that I do think I could have shaved another 10,000 (well in theory 10,000) off a month after some study.

Yeah, this is the last time I think I need to post on this.

My original post was about trying to improve my lot financially so I wasn't living on the fringe. After studying it again, it isn't completely unlivable and even with a new mouth to feed things might have worked out, but it is always stressful when your sources of income don't pay much and the conditions have you running around 7-days a week. Anyways, what is done is done. Have fun you crazy cats.

SUPER SUPER SUPER congrats on the new job!!!!!!!!! that is great news!!! That extra amount per month will be more than enough to give you a buffer. I hope the new job doesn't have you working crazy hours (or will at least give you a couple of days a week off, you'll need it with a new baby! ) and hopefully you'll have better future prospects with this job too.

While there were some people who were just plain nasty (the same bunch who attack other posts) the majority of the people were just waiting to see your breakdown to see if there was anything that could be saved on each month. I almost completed a financial planning course so I know from experience that even when people think they can't save money, it's often the case that money can be saved each month with just a few simple adjustments.


Good luck with the new job!!

[Agitator]

so why are you being so anal?

Why are you being so stupid?

Judgmentally,
A.

[Agitator]

To the crack about family planning and "don't have kids you can't afford", we could afford them from all the signs we had, but conception->birth takes 9 months and a lot can happen in that span. We are getting on in age and have always wanted children. It was a risk but one we both decided to take.

As long as you man up to your responsibilities (and by all accounts you are), I don't see any problem here. If both you and your wife were just lazing around the home all day, refusing to work simply because you were a bunch of leeches, that'd be a whole other story. Sadly the world is filled with people of that variety.

To all of you that don't like it that your taxes cover the subsidies I get, tough. I don't like to take it and would like a better lot, but here is the good news.

Well I'd rather tax money go to your family than repaving the same fuxking road in front of my building every six months, or idiotic infrastructure projects that serve no one, or all the other bullsh!t that the Japanese government usually spends it on. (Aside: How can the Japanese government blow through so much cash and have so little to show for it? The mind boggles.)

After the initial posting I got a few messages about various positions and ended up bagging an interview and just got an offer tonight substantially higher (not up to 500k/month, but over 400k anyways) so I'd like to extend a big middle finger to all the haters.

At that level you're already making more than a good majority of the people that populate this place. Bunch of loser eikaiwa monkeys or other hangers-on to the very far fringes of respectable society.

Oh, and on the "bad with money" bit, my wife was hospitalized and mother in law passed away and that takes money. Go f*ck yourself. Without that, after deductions to my base salary, health insurance, income tax, etc. (brings it down to under 220k), loan payment, food, utilities, clothes, transportation (not covered), I ended up with about 3~4man.

Well there's your problem. You're actually paying your health insurance bill! You should take lessons from a very knowledgeable long-time Japan resident that hangs out here. He'll tell you all about the merits of not paying health insurance premiums.

My original post was about trying to improve my lot financially so I wasn't living on the fringe. After studying it again, it isn't completely unlivable and even with a new mouth to feed things might have worked out, but it is always stressful when your sources of income don't pay much and the conditions have you running around 7-days a week. Anyways, what is done is done. Have fun you crazy cats.

Good on you. Hope it all works out.

Respectfully,
A.

[rich dude kryptonite]

I believe that no one can judge the sacrifices that many single parents make every day for their children.
I suppose the point is to look beyond transitional roles and do what makes sense for the family as a whole, examine the choices available, and not stand on egotism.

This is the YokohamaTommy I know.

I was really surprised at your first post. It was an unnecessary attack on working mothers. We get it from all ends anyway, don't need it from people on the internet as well.

But your next posts were even worse, and not what I've come to expect from you.

There are just as many unemployed mothers who feed their children retorte curry as employed mothers. Quality of meals or parenting has little to do with whether a parent works or not.
I said nothing about unemployed women being parasites, that was you putting words in my mouth.

I don't know why you used the word homemaker, as if mothers who have paying jobs don't make the house as much of a home as those who don't have paid employment.

I also don't know why you keep referring to America. This is Japan, where the PTA mom rules and working mothers (and their pitited husbands) get trod on everyday. I don't know anything about America or their tax systems (do they have the generous tax subsidies for unemployed women based on status that Japan has, regardless of whether there are children to be looked after?) but I do know it was the US writing the tax system after WW2 that gave us this problem.

My kids eat much healthier than anyone I know in Japan as we don't eat refined sugar (my husband has allergies). This happens whether I am on maternity leave or not.

My comment about contributing was actually about men contributing to the household. In the majority of Japanese households, the father works insane hours outside of the house, and never does anything for his children or to contribute to the household, partly because he doesn't have time, and partly because women treat men as idiots in this country. You should see the attention my husband gets for occasionally picking up the kids or running errands. If he attends the PTA volunteer debacles, he inevitably is given the easiest task and one of the women then does it for him. A more fair system is good for everyone in this country, and more women in the worforce would mean men get a break from their hours at work and can be expected to actually do stuff for their children. Not to mention that there is more time wasted in this country than in any other I've lived. Children need role models who have time management skills. Every year now that my kids are in elementary school I get some mother who has started a 10-hour a week part-time job coming up to me to ask how in the world it is possible to make meals after work. I tell them about setting the timer on rice cookers and slow cookers, but the truth of it is if you don't watch tv on weekdays it's much easier. But they don't know because they didn't learn from their own mothers or neighbours.

On Tuesday I went to pick up my 3rd kid from kindy and attend a PTA meeting, at which all the other parents were handed big brown envelopes of cash. With 4 kids I would get somewhere around 45man for putting my kid in kindy, except I pay taxes. So they were rewarded for being financially irresponsible! Then they were talking about their little mama volleyball club which they have, and when I said I couldn't go because I have work, they all turned to me at once and stared at the baby on my hip as if I had just admitted I sell their children heroin. I am tired of people telling me I and my children are kawaisou because I work. As if I am the one who is taking money instead of providing it for them.

I know you think that working mothers aren't pariahs, but we are. I have a friend in Kyushu who went to the interview for her son's kindergarten, got accepted, and then was told her son could not come after she said "thanks, I have to get back to work". He was refused a place just because he has a working mother and that's "not good for the children." We are treated terribly.

I don't work because I have to, I do it because I love it, I have put in years of work and study to get to my position, and I have 42 people in the department I built from scratch depending on me for their livelihood. If I don't have formulae to solve and lab equipment to fool with I am unhappy, and my kids don't deserve to have someone who sacrifices what they love. That's a bad role model. I'm sorry that there are people out there that are unhappy with their jobs, I don't understand that. I used to work in a more traditional company and although I loved the work it was hard because of the attitudes around a woman working in the hard sciences.

I actually don't mind that taxes go to parents staying home with young children, although that is not the right decision for us. But from 3 kids are in school and activities and once kids are in elementary school (and it goes by quicker than you can imagine) then they are usually home later than me and most working mothers (and would be if fathers had decent hours). But in Japan once a woman quits then most of them don't go back. I have no idea what they do all day, but if a man was unemployed for 20 years and has no kids at home what would we say about them?


If you do have an unemployed spouse I hope you have extremely good insurance policies. I know what it's like to be the child of a stay-at-home-mum who because her husband decided to walk in front of a lorry after a night out at the pub had to look after 3 children and 1 on the way by scrubbing floors and depending on the "charity" of the church of Scotland. I would never put any child in that position even by accident.

I know that I am in a priviledged position, there are very few women department heads in Japan who can set their own hours. I have a cleaning woman and gardener and can afford to import the best foods for my kids and have parents-in-law who help and I can afford to fly in my mother to help. I know it's not that easy for most working women in this country. But being a working mom is not in any way bad for children. That was the offensive statement I was reacting to in your first post. Then you restated that you think my children are being raised by strangers. Those are the true myths! I am raising my children with my husband. Of course other people are involved, they are with stay-at-home mums too! All the other kids at my children's kindy have stay-at-home mums but send their kids to kindy. Are they not raising their children? That's an unfair statement and not worthy of you.

[ttokyo]

The other has some room for improvement salary-wise and might make the two jobs redundant in the long run but progress is slow on that front. I have been poking around the job markets (IT as well as education/nursery), but the entry salaries offered are comparatively low and I wouldn't want to take a dip in income at this time. I have connections and former colleagues that have also been poking around on my behalf, but nothing has panned out. Part of it is my age, and part of it is due to the changing job fields in which I have worked over the years.

??? You have several years of experience and then still get entry-level salaries ? You're selling yourself below market, applying to the wrong companies or your skills are really poor...

Part of it is my age, and part of it is due to the changing job fields in which I have worked over the years. They see me as the jack of all trades (which isn't a bad thing depending on the company and the job responsibilities).

That's what I am saying. Smaller gaishikei often have a limited number of staff anyway. I've seen companies of 10-20 people with just one or two gaijin and they would often prefer people who know a bit of everything.

Still another part of it is location. I own land and a house and my location is fixed so unless the offer is really good (and I haven't had anything like that), I can't justify an extremely long (2.5+ hour) commute to work to make less than what I do now, and moving is out of the question with such a low bill each month on the house loan.

So where is that house ? To me it seems that this is the main reason you don't find a well-paying job as it is in the middle of nowhere. I just checked the homepage of the american chamber of commerce and they have hundreds of job listings, mainly in IT.

[Agitator]

There are just as many unemployed mothers who feed their children retorte curry as employed mothers. Quality of meals or parenting has little to do with whether a parent works or not.
I said nothing about unemployed women being parasites, that was you putting words in my mouth.

You said, and I quote (emphasis added): "Being a working mother in this country is hard, but the worst part of it is when people like you treat the people paying taxes so that unemployed wives can get free pensions and not have to pay their own fair share of taxes like pariahs."

Those "unemployed" wives getting "free" pensions and not paying their "fair share" of taxes... sounds like a parasite to me.

I also don't know why you keep referring to America. This is Japan, where the PTA mom rules and working mothers (and their pitited husbands) get trod on everyday.

If it bothers you this much, why don't you leave? Many things about Japan bother me a lot, so I'm planning to leave.

My kids eat much healthier than anyone I know in Japan as we don't eat refined sugar (my husband has allergies). This happens whether I am on maternity leave or not.

You seem to enjoy looking down on all other families, and especially other mothers, with a huge amount of smugness. Is that a chip on your shoulder, or a boulder?

On Tuesday I went to pick up my 3rd kid from kindy and attend a PTA meeting, at which all the other parents were handed big brown envelopes of cash. With 4 kids I would get somewhere around 45man for putting my kid in kindy, except I pay taxes. So they were rewarded for being financially irresponsible!

Big envelopes of cash! Millions of yen for the families. WOOOHOOOOO!!! Mega Millions Giveaway!!!!! Get a grip on reality. The PTA is not distributing big amounts of money to anyone, no matter what you think. If you have concrete evidence of this, present it.

I know you think that working mothers aren't pariahs, but we are. I have a friend in Kyushu who went to the interview for her son's kindergarten, got accepted, and then was told her son could not come after she said "thanks, I have to get back to work". He was refused a place just because he has a working mother and that's "not good for the children."

I don't think this is what happened. Either you or your friend is exaggerating, or there are some key details left out. But in any case, we all get it - Japan doesn't treat working mothers particularly well. So why do you have to sit around and constantly berate every other mother who does not have an out-of-the-home job?

I don't work because I have to, I do it because I love it, I have put in years of work and study to get to my position, and I have 42 people in the department I built from scratch depending on me for their livelihood. If I don't have formulae to solve and lab equipment to fool with I am unhappy, and my kids don't deserve to have someone who sacrifices what they love.

That's great. It really is (no sarcasm). And I am happy for you. But note the key bit of that - you do it "because (you) love it". So despite all this other supposed sh!t that so deeply offends you, you still made the choice. Why the hell do you care what any of these other people think? Especially since you apparently think they're all worthless freeloaders?

I actually don't mind that taxes go to parents staying home with young children, although that is not the right decision for us.

You actually don't mind, yet you wrote:

"Quality of life is a family paying their fair share of taxes instead of stealing from others to support an unemployed woman"
"So they were rewarded for being financially irresponsible!"
"As if I am the one who is taking money instead of providing it for them."

So which is it?

I have no idea what they do all day, but if a man was unemployed for 20 years and has no kids at home what would we say about them?

If he had a wife paying for everything, I'd call him a lucky SOB. But that's just me.

I know it's not that easy for most working women in this country. But being a working mom is not in any way bad for children.

So why do you constantly bash what you call "unemployed mothers"? I think you're either jealous, or bitter, or angry, or whatever. I also suspect you probably have some vendetta against Japanese women, for whatever reason.

Mrs. A. is a stay-at-home mom. (She's Japanese, too. Does that get your blood boiling?) The A. family has been very fortunate in that I make a very good income which allows us this choice. After we got married she was working, but when we decided to have our first child, she decided (and it was her decision) to leave. Once our youngest is a bit older, she does want to go back to work, probably part-time for a variety of reasons. I'm in full support of whatever she wants to do. If our situation changed and she had to work for us to make ends meet, she'd do it, and that would be fine. It's fortunate that we can afford to make this choice, and I understand there are plenty of families for whom the finances mean that two working parents is mandatory.

I certainly don't think my wife is a freeloader and I would never use the word "unemployed" in a derogatory manner to describe her, or any other stay-at-home mom. In fact, I'd say she works a lot harder than I do! Our optimal set up has been that I earn the outside income, she does not have to have an outside job. We pay a fuxkload of taxes. I don't know where you come up with all these "subsidies". We do (for now) get the kodomo teate because, at the moment, it's not means-tested but you must be getting it, too. I do get a 330,000 yen tax deduction for having a dependent spouse, but I can tell you for a fact that if my income was split 50/50 between my wife and me, we'd be paying far less in income taxes because of lower marginal rates. (Unlike the married tax brackets in the US, so I don't know where you get your absurd idea that the tax system in Japan is some evil concoction of the USA.)

Yet, I don't bemoan the situation. We're quite lucky. We planned ahead, we were prepared, and we were fortunate. Two of those things were under our control, one was not (although I am a big believer that you make most of your own luck). We have made our choice, you have made yours.

On your final point there, I would submit that if being a working mother makes you this angry and hostile, then you being a working mother might be bad for your children. Surely this kind of deeply-rooted latent anger and passive aggressive behavior must come through in your parenting.

Scornfully,
A.

[Agitator]

So where is that house ? To me it seems that this is the main reason you don't find a well-paying job as it is in the middle of nowhere. I just checked the homepage of the american chamber of commerce and they have hundreds of job listings, mainly in IT.

Guess he'd rather have a cheap house than a decently-paying job. I wouldn't make that choice, but whatever floats his boat, I guess.

Perplexedly,
A.

[YokohamaTommy]

I was really surprised at your first post. It was an unnecessary attack on working mothers.

That was not my intention in any shape.

There are just as many unemployed mothers who feed their children retorte curry as employed mothers. Quality of meals or parenting has little to do with whether a parent works or not.

It's a trade off. Both parents cannot each be both perfectly-dedicated career people AND super-parents at the same time.
As noble as that idea is, there's simply not enough hours in the day.
It's not realistic.

I also don't know why you keep referring to America.

I am aware of that Japan is not America. However I am not Japanese, and I assume the OP is also not Japanese, but I also feel there are certain things which transcend culture in this case.

But being a working mom is not in any way bad for children. That was the offensive statement I was reacting to in your first post.

I think you over-reacted a bit.
The spirit of the post was to provide the OP with a different way of looking at things, not an attack on you personally.
Do I think that a working mother is bad for children? Of course not.
But I think one spouse should be available most times if possible.
I genuinely and earnestly appreciate your insights, but I wish you might paint the issue with a wider brush.

I admit I also failed to do this, so I thank you for pointing that out.
Your insights remind me of this:

"In dwelling, live close to the ground. In thinking, keep to the simple. In conflict, be fair and generous. In governing, don't try to control. In work, do what you enjoy. In family life, be completely present.

It seems that you are.

[Teacher101]

I just spent a few minutes on the forum search engine trying to find the old thread on being frugal/cheap in Japan, with quite a few good suggestions. I thought it could be of some help to the OP, but I can't find it. Anyone know the name of that thread, or think they can find and link it here?

[rich dude kryptonite]

Agitator, it seems to me that you are projecting. I have not in any way bashed unemployed mothers- other that to say I don't want them to treat me badly.
Look at how sensitive you are, going out of your way to imply I am racist and sexist, just because you read into my words that your family's setup is something I "bashed". Don't you think it would be worse if I actually did bash you and I was reaping your tax dollars?

If you were treated badly by a police officer or with scorn by a teacher or city hall worker, someone you knew was getting your tax money, wouldn't you be upset? You would certainly have the right to be, as I have the right to be upset at being treated badly.

If it bothers you this much, why don't you leave? Many things about Japan bother me a lot, so I'm planning to leave.

Ah yes, the old "if you don't like it, leave!" I love a lot of things about my life here, certainly more than in the other countries in which I have lived and worked and studied. So what if I am upset about the tax system and the way a certain cadre of people treat us. Most other people treat us well, I have a very good job and am in the middle of my PhD, I am raising my Japanese children in good Japanese schools, and I am building a new house here. I'm here for the longterm, and yes I will try to change the bad things that are here. First by getting Japanese citizenship so I can vote in a better party and second by raising awareness of the issue. I love Japan and don't want it to go down the drain.

Big envelopes of cash! Millions of yen for the families. WOOOHOOOOO!!! Mega Millions Giveaway!!!!! Get a grip on reality. The PTA is not distributing big amounts of money to anyone, no matter what you think. If you have concrete evidence of this, present it.

I didn't say it was the PTA. It's the kindergarten on behalf of the city. This happens in every municipality in the country, although the amount differs, but it is handed out in cash twice a year to those who pay less than 18man a year in taxes.
Here's just a single example, but you can check with your municipality too.
http://www.city.toda.saitama.jp/DAT/...yamihyou23.pdf

So why do you constantly bash what you call "unemployed mothers"?

I have not bashed unemployed mothers. I call them that because I get railed on if I call them non-working mothers, and many stay-at-home mums in this country work at home so that doesn't fit. This is the only term that works with the situation I am trying to characterise, if you have a problem with that, it's what you are reading into it not mine.

Stating you don't want to pay for something doesn't mean you are bashing it. I'm also against write-offs for small business owners, that doesn't mean I am bashing small business owners, and I don't want a single yen to go to the Tokyo Sky Tree, it doesn't mean I am bashing that.

I don't think this is what happened. Either you or your friend is exaggerating, or there are some key details left out.

So you think I am a liar, just like with the money you didn't know about. There's no answer to that, I guess, since you are scornful of all the hard truths I've written. My friend was telling the truth, she was refused a place for her son in kindergarten because she is a working mother. I'm sorry that you are so closed-minded that you aren't interested in others' worldviews.

I don't know where you come up with all these "subsidies". We do (for now) get the kodomo teate because, at the moment, it's not means-tested but you must be getting it, too.

Yes, I get the kodomo-teate, which is also a ridiculous waste of money. I can't wait for it to go back to the old LDP system later this year.
I'm sorry you are unaware of all your benefits, but perhaps a visit to your local council is in order?
http://www.japantimes.co.jp/text/nn20111206i1.html
http://www.japantimes.co.jp/text/fd20111023pb.html
http://blog.japantimes.co.jp/yen-for...ewives-unfair/
http://www.japantimes.co.jp/text/rc20111211a1.html

[xHime]

It's a bit late for that but reading this I cannot help but ask myself....if you can hardly make ends meet with the number of children you have now, why have another? There are forms of contraception out there.

Honestly in this economy most people should really stop at 1. Either way, good luck to you.

[ttokyo]

Honestly in this economy most people should really stop at 1. Either way, good luck to you.

... with the collapse of pension schemes, you might need to rely on your kids to care for you when you retire...