Laws/Rules regarding water rights

[Shakes Spear]

Curious about what Japan's policies are in regards to owning or controlling rivers.

In the U.S. it is basically a state by state issue with some giving the owners of the property a river runs through control of it, but many dictating that you cannot own flowing water.

The reason I ask is that I enjoy kayaking and I'm wondering what my rights are if I want to just drop in at a popular spot that is being used by some type of recreational tours or rentals company.

I've already had a minor run-in with someone who claimed that if I wanted to paddle in waters that they use for payees, I'd have to cough up an hourly fee.

I just smiled and gave a few "wakarimasen"s and continued about my business, but I fear one day it may escalate and I doubt anyone carries around a book of covenants and bylaws.

Obviously most Japanese, to avoid confrontation at all costs, would just bow deeply whilst profusely apologizing and then turn with tail between legs.

I'm not wired like that!

Thanks in advance for any insight on this.

[ENF]

I think the only stipulation is where you actually drop in at. Such as private land or whatnot...

The water itself, if it's a natural location such as a lake, river or other body of water... there's nothing preventing you from using the waterway.

A quick skim through some of the popular rivers and water ways, doesn't turn up anything about having to pay someone or if someone can control the waterway.

One thing that does stick out though, some places may have areas that farmers may want you to avoid, where they are farming in certain areas.

(obviously, this applies to small boats, canoes --- rules are different for bigger, powered boating)

[Shakes Spear]

I think the only stipulation is where you actually drop in at. Such as private land or whatnot...

The water itself, if it's a natural location such as a lake, river or other body of water... there's nothing preventing you from using the waterway.

A quick skim through some of the popular rivers and water ways, doesn't turn up anything about having to pay someone or if someone can control the waterway.

One thing that does stick out though, some places may have areas that farmers may want you to avoid, where they are farming in certain areas.

(obviously, this applies to small boats, canoes --- rules are different for bigger, powered boating)

Yeah, that's pretty much what my line of thinking was. You're always gonna get a few arseholes that want to try and intimidate you or take you for some money if they can, but unless they can provide documentation I'm gonna hold my ground...errr...water.

Without a whole lot of my own knowledge of what's navigable, fun, dangerous, etc., the easiest thing to do is research where the tour groups are and just go there.
I like doing my own exploring but with the way they dam all of the waterways here, it's risky dropping in and floating downstream blind.

[kurogane]

I've already had a minor run-in with someone who claimed that if I wanted to paddle in waters that they use for payees, I'd have to cough up an hourly fee..

Is these waters a public waterway????

They probably have a commercial use licence, but since they are commercially exploiting the river, they need one.

You don't, and since you aren't a customer of theirs, and it isn't their water, I would give them a hearty Ki e Usero and paddle on.


It's probably just a pencil dick with a Tojo complex.


Unless the landing you used is theirs................

[Shakes Spear]

How fast can you kayak? Unless they have a kayak also, pretty much all they can do is yell at you from the banks

Seriously though, I was wondering about this too.

It's the guys with rafts and kayaks that I'm worried about. And when I say worried, I don't mean the "Oh no, I'm gonna get in trouble!" worried.
I'm talking about a confrontation that could potentially escalate into a situation that might be inappropriate for my 6 year old to witness.

The rafters and kayakers don't tend to be as bad as the "Ayukuza", but they don't like pesky foreigners showing the sheep a cheaper way to enjoy their leisure activities either.

[Shakes Spear]

Is these waters a public waterway????

They probably have a commercial use licence, but since they are commercially exploiting the river, they need one.

You don't, and since you aren't a customer of theirs, and it isn't their water, I would give them a hearty Ki e Usero and paddle on.


It's probably just a pencil dick with a Tojo complex.


Unless the landing you used is theirs................

Yeah, we're talking free flowing (up until the dams) nature made (except for the parts where the banks are concrete) rivers (OK, oversized streams).

Of course I avoid dropping in at their landings. They're pretty much ALL pencil dicks with a Tojo complex, but I fear they may suffer the same fate as him if they harass me.

[hml]

Curious about what Japan's policies are in regards to owning or controlling rivers.

Not sure, but a quick inquiry at the local town office should provide you with what you need to know. There should be an office that handles the rivers. Eg. the one for roads and parks is 土木管理局. I'm too lazy to look up something I don't already know. But please post it here when you find out.

I just smiled and gave a few "wakarimasen"s and continued about my business, but I fear one day it may escalate and I doubt anyone carries around a book of covenants and bylaws.

Obviously most Japanese, to avoid confrontation at all costs, would just bow deeply whilst profusely apologizing and then turn with tail between legs.

I'm not wired like that!

Good for you.

It has already been said, but I agree that the only legal issue you might have is entering someone else's property to get to and from the water. Aside from that, I see no p

It's probably just a pencil dick with a Tojo complex.

What if it's a Tojo with a pencil dick complex?

[kurogane]

What if it's a Tojo with a pencil dick complex?

Coz Tojo don't kayak???



Anyways, Shakey,

Yeah, I would go semi-native and just avoid them as possible.

Otherwise, just shake your spear at them.

And the Kie Usero line usually works for me with busybodies and such.

[Effected After]

Here is how you deal with this the Japanese way:

Them: "Hey, you can't use this without a permit"
You: "Ah soo..." [paddles away ignoring them]

[Shakes Spear]

Coz Tojo don't kayak???



Anyways, Shakey,

Yeah, I would go semi-native and just avoid them as possible.

Otherwise, just shake your spear at them.

And the Kie Usero line usually works for me with busybodies and such.

I've definitely added Kie Usero to my quiver!

[Shakes Spear]

Here is how you deal with this the Japanese way:

Them: "Hey, you can't use this without a permit"
You: "Ah soo..." [paddles away ignoring them]

The beauty of that method is that you're really saying asshole! I prefer just saying "arigatou!" while nodding my head and smiling. It really irritates them to think that I'm misinterpreting their message to be a positive.

It's not that they want you to have a permit, it's wanting you to pay them for circumventing their overpriced niche business.

[hml]

Just print this out, laminate it and put it on a name-holder necklace. Everything will be fine.

[hml]

sorry that was so big! hahahaha

[Shakes Spear]

Just print this out, laminate it and put it on a name-holder necklace. Everything will be fine.

SaWEEEEET!!!!

[hml]

SaWEEEEET!!!!

Please drink a beer for me while in your boat. And while staring directly at the punk who told you to pay. Then burp. Loudly. Please be sure to position yourself so the sound will echo off the rocks. An area with a slow current is best. :P

[kurogane]

It's not that they want you to have a permit, it's wanting you to pay them for circumventing their overpriced niche business.

Exactically. More importantly, their attempts at extortion, or fraud, if you will, are what raise my ire.

You heard me.

I have been told by an illegal kiosk operator while setting up a picnic at a riverside park bench that I would have to buy the food and drink for same
from his sketchy looking kiosk, as he had Exclusive Rights to food and drink sales in the park.

I noted that we weren't purchasing either, as we had brought our own, asked to see his permit and sanitation badge, and he went Buraku on me. We moved down the river a few hundred yards, and he actually closed up his kiosk in order to continue his harassment of us.

My ex told him to leave us alone, he retorted that he didn't need to take that sort of crap from a foreigner's whore, I gave my usual diplomatic response to such, we quickly packed up and left, and on the way back to the station, I told the duty constable at the local police box that the kiosk operator was flashing the children playing in the playground, and ran like hell for the station.

Our picnic was quite ruined, but Oh!, did my ex laugh at the Flasher ruse I used to the cop.


Have any of you ever met Japanese that go on about Jews and their obsession with money and general petty stinginess????

Having lived among both, I can barely suppress a guffaw at the idea that a bunch of niggrardly misers like the Jpn would try to look down on anybody at all.