Retirement

[TJrandom]

Retirement… is just a few days away for me now. So I do believe I will be a less frequent visitor here for a while as I get settled into a new routine. I’ll be refocusing my energies on completing the move and transition from Tokyo living to country living, catching up on my hobbies, and maybe adding a couple.

I have been winding down my number of work days for a couple of years now and have our retirement home 99.9% complete. But I still have a home in Tokyo which I will either sell, or convert into a rental – either way it will take some doing and probably not be completed until the end of the year.

So my list of upcoming tasks includes:

Tokyo home cleanup/repair/rental or sale
Country home – minor outstanding tasks
Paint the barn & remodel the shop area for better utilization
Step up to well manage the garden – no longer tolerate the weeds
Step up to better manage the ornamental and fruit trees
Complete the Japanese nationality application (now almost done)
Spend more time with the grandkids and other relatives
Increase the number of honey bee apiaries and the number of hives at each
Better manage my golden girls (honey bees)
Ride more frequently
Take up fishing (after a 30 year lapse)
Travel more – aiming at a week twice a year outside of Japan and twice within

Do you have post retirement plans – or a good idea as to how you will be spending your time?

[Morton]

Seems like a nice relaxing lifestyle. Can I ask how old are you roughly?

While I'm jealous that you can retire and lead the kind of lifestyle you want, I'm not so jealous about being 60 or so; though it's fast creeping up.


Personally I'm a compulsive saver. I have two properties, one almost done and the other still has around 15,000,000 to go. I just hope to have no debt and sufficient saving to life a simple life in a slightly better climate than where I am at present.

[TJrandom]

.... Can I ask how old are you roughly?

While I'm jealous that you can retire and lead the kind of lifestyle you want, I'm not so jealous about being 60 or so; though it's fast creeping up.


Personally I'm a compulsive saver. ....

62 - except when I am a randy 18 year old....

And congratulations on being a compulsive saver - it will set you free.

[shonanfred]

Congratulations TJR...must feel pretty good!
Can I ask how much you figure you'll need to budget monthly to retire comfortably here?
We hope to have both the house and the cottage paid off in 10 years and aim to scale back the work week soon thereafter.
Fred

[TJrandom]

Congratulations TJR...must feel pretty good!
Can I ask how much you figure you'll need to budget monthly to retire comfortably here?
We hope to have both the house and the cottage paid off in 10 years and aim to scale back the work week soon thereafter.
Fred

400,000/month, or 4.8m/year - will safely pay for our bills and travel with a bit left over. We have no debt so can cut back from that if necessary. The rental income, if we do not sell it - should come to half of that each month, and the national pension (postponed until 67) should come to nearly half. We have sufficient savings to not need the pension even with medical bills increasing with age, with increased inflation, and the expected tax increases - so no financial worries. We grow a bit ourselves - but not enough to live on, but it does help. Extra in one crop gets traded in the neighborhood for something we do not grow.

[shonanfred]

Thanks man.
We are looking to buy another property in either Izu or Chiba (something with some elbow room for a garden) and renting out our current house in Shonan....not unlike what your plans are.
Fred

[oxymoron]

Retirement… is just a few days away for me now. So I do believe I will be a less frequent visitor here for a while as I get settled into a new routine. I’ll be refocusing my energies on completing the move and transition from Tokyo living to country living, catching up on my hobbies, and maybe adding a couple.

I have been winding down my number of work days for a couple of years now and have our retirement home 99.9% complete. But I still have a home in Tokyo which I will either sell, or convert into a rental – either way it will take some doing and probably not be completed until the end of the year.

So my list of upcoming tasks includes:

Tokyo home cleanup/repair/rental or sale
Country home – minor outstanding tasks
Paint the barn & remodel the shop area for better utilization
Step up to well manage the garden – no longer tolerate the weeds
Step up to better manage the ornamental and fruit trees
Complete the Japanese nationality application (now almost done)
Spend more time with the grandkids and other relatives
Increase the number of honey bee apiaries and the number of hives at each
Better manage my golden girls (honey bees)
Ride more frequently
Take up fishing (after a 30 year lapse)
Travel more – aiming at a week twice a year outside of Japan and twice within

Do you have post retirement plans – or a good idea as to how you will be spending your time?

Congratulations on your impending retirement!
I'm now 65, first retired at 45 and twice more since. The one thing I have learned is to keep busy, both physically and mentally, because retirement gets very boring, very fast.
Having said that, the freedom you have in retirement is pure gold! As for getting old, if you keep fit, old age is a myth.
Good luck and I'm sure you'll enjoy it.

[TJrandom]

Thanks man.
We are looking to buy another property in either Izu or Chiba (something with some elbow room for a garden) and renting out our current house in Shonan....not unlike what your plans are.
Fred

We looked in Izu for about three years before giving up on Izu. With the narrow seaside strip of land and immediate mountains that define Izu - we could not find anything other than a Tokyo-like postage stamp. Hence we switched to Chiba - much cheaper, much more available. Plus the transportation is actually better - Aqua Line only plugs up with high winds and holiday peak travel times, which can be avoided most particularly if you are retired.

[TJrandom]

Congratulations on your impending retirement!
I'm now 65, first retired at 45 and twice more since. The one thing I have learned is to keep busy, both physically and mentally, because retirement gets very boring, very fast.
Having said that, the freedom you have in retirement is pure gold! As for getting old, if you keep fit, old age is a myth.
Good luck and I'm sure you'll enjoy it.

Thanks for that. I actually enjoy working - physical labor that is, and with the size of our place, number of trees requiring care, and hobbies - I can't see getting bored. Too much to do....

[thefg]

Retirement… is just a few days away for me now. So I do believe I will be a less frequent visitor here for a while as I get settled into a new routine. I’ll be refocusing my energies on completing the move and transition from Tokyo living to country living, catching up on my hobbies, and maybe adding a couple.

I have been winding down my number of work days for a couple of years now and have our retirement home 99.9% complete. But I still have a home in Tokyo which I will either sell, or convert into a rental – either way it will take some doing and probably not be completed until the end of the year.

So my list of upcoming tasks includes:

Tokyo home cleanup/repair/rental or sale
Country home – minor outstanding tasks
Paint the barn & remodel the shop area for better utilization
Step up to well manage the garden – no longer tolerate the weeds
Step up to better manage the ornamental and fruit trees
Complete the Japanese nationality application (now almost done)
Spend more time with the grandkids and other relatives
Increase the number of honey bee apiaries and the number of hives at each
Better manage my golden girls (honey bees)
Ride more frequently
Take up fishing (after a 30 year lapse)
Travel more – aiming at a week twice a year outside of Japan and twice within

Do you have post retirement plans – or a good idea as to how you will be spending your time?

lovely!


congrats

i tried retiring when i was 35 but i was just not able to shed the feeling of purposelessnesslesness. i went back to work. my current plan is to retire at 50.

i have a large property on a tropical island with a beautiful garden waiting for me. but im not ready for it yet! still have things i want to achieve in industry first.

[KansaiBen]

lovely!


congrats

i tried retiring when i was 35 but i was just not able to shed the feeling of purposelessnesslesness. i went back to work. my current plan is to retire at 50..

The average lifespan of western males is 75. You plan to sit on the beach for 25 years?

[TJrandom]

The average lifespan of western males is 75. You plan to sit on the beach for 25 years?

I have known a few who did retire in their early 50s - and they enjoyed every minute of it. Of course they were financially secure. At 50 I wasn't, and I have a longevity risk - in that my relatives all live into their mid to later 90s - so I needed to postpone it a bit myself.

[shonanfred]

The average lifespan of western males is 75. You plan to sit on the beach for 25 years?

KB go away please and take your negativity with you.
Fred

[shonanfred]

We looked in Izu for about three years before giving up on Izu. With the narrow seaside strip of land and immediate mountains that define Izu - we could not find anything other than a Tokyo-like postage stamp. Hence we switched to Chiba - much cheaper, much more available. Plus the transportation is actually better - Aqua Line only plugs up with high winds and holiday peak travel times, which can be avoided most particularly if you are retired.

Spot on.
Tiny tiny plots, but you can get them for next to nothing.
We dive, surf and fish so Izu has everything we want except the "elbow room".
Happy for you man.
Fred

[Klausdorth]

TJ (and others)

Good comments (except for the one mentioned already)!

Concerning national pension "paying half" - how many years did you pay in the pension fund?
Does this "half" include what your wife will get?
I paid 21 years so far, and I doubt it will be enough "nenkin" to live on.
Well, at least I will also (hopefully) get a small amount from the German pension system.

As for me, still another (almost) 10 years until I can hopefully retire.
Also considering to get some land - if size and money are ok.

In case you don't want to discuss the "financial aspect" here, please send me an e-mail.

[TJrandom]

....Concerning national pension "paying half" - how many years did you pay in the pension fund?
Does this "half" include what your wife will get? ....

I have paid in 32 years - and by 67 - will have paid in 37. Plus - I have my 10 in the US, but due to their "windfall provision" - will get a reduced US payout. So all in - Japan, US, and of course my wife's - which is based solely on my income - it should exceed 200,000/month. That is - unless some restrictions get added between now and then. Fortunately - we do not need the pension, having saved ferociously over the years. By half - I meant "half of what it will take us to live on comfortably".

[thefg]

The average lifespan of western males is 75. You plan to sit on the beach for 25 years?

no i plan on sitting in my garden for 25 years, oh and enjoy my many hobbies. i may start a little business for fun - but the 9-5 days will be gone

[TJrandom]

... but the 9-5 days will be gone

9 to 5? How about 6 to 8 - or 4:30 to 9:30 if commute is added on. Yabadabadooo!

[thefg]

9 to 5? How about 6 to 8 - or 4:30 to 9:30 if commute is added on. Yabadabadooo!

ive always worked 9-5 here



japanese people work long hours because they dont work effectively (waste a lot if time and no idea about DOE)

nobody has ever questioned why i dont work longer hours - they see my results - and i have never tried or wanted to be 'japanese'

im 'special' in part because i am.


I can drive to work in 15 mins or jog there in 35 so commutes no issue

your retirement plans sound idyllic. I recently looked at a chiba property for a weekend get away - nice garden size

[TJrandom]

... I recently looked at a chiba property for a weekend get away - nice garden size

Our requirements were:

Excellent medical, good transportation, good shops & restaurants, close access to sea and mountains, bee (honey) friendly, larger than 600 tsubo, and vegi-garden-able.

[Majestic]

Congratulations TJ! Sounds like a great retirement plan.

[wernst]

congrats TJ. Sounds like a good life. Im only starting in my 30ies but already want to retire heh

[TJrandom]

congrats TJ. Sounds like a good life. Im only starting in my 30ies but already want to retire heh

Thanks wernst, Majestic - and all other above who have wished me well - I do appreciate it. (But of course - I'll still be here needling you all from time to time.... and of course making an arse of myself too.)

[wernst]

... and of course making an arse of myself too.)

I think Genkii's got that covered ^^

[ozzijp]

Complete the Japanese nationality application (now almost done)

Personally, can't get my head around this but to each his own.

Anyway, great thread. I have a few years left myself but..I am quietly trying to get it done.

I think all readers who love the surf should consider Kyushu as a retirement destination. It's pretty, pretty, pretty good ( Curb Your Enthusiasm).

[Super Grover]

We looked in Izu for about three years before giving up on Izu. With the narrow seaside strip of land and immediate mountains that define Izu - we could not find anything other than a Tokyo-like postage stamp. Hence we switched to Chiba - much cheaper, much more available. Plus the transportation is actually better - Aqua Line only plugs up with high winds and holiday peak travel times, which can be avoided most particularly if you are retired.

Congratulations on your retirement! It seems you will have plenty to keep you suitably occupied.
You chose Chiba. I understand that rural Chiba has great scenery and I have seen some of it, but whenever I hear "Chiba," somehow I always think "Soga."

Izu is nice, but gets more violent weather. We thought (think?) of living in Izu Kogen, but still fear The Big Earthquake. There are some very nice places in central to east Shizuoka (tea fields are gorgeous), much more so than in western Shizuoka and the cusp of Aichi, where it's drab.

FWIW, our "retirement" will not be that at all. For us, "retirement" means totally new jobs for quite a while. If I were to fully retire at 65 (I'm a ways away from there in any case), I would probably go nuts. Besides, based on genetic background, I expect to be around for another 30 years at least. There is little difference these days between 40 and 55 or 65 and 75, so we want to work, grow veggies, fruits and flowers, teach part-time and/or do consulting on the side, see some parts of Mexico, go to the Andes, etc. Sitting around watching TV, eating donuts, and reminiscing about the past are not part of the plan.
Enjoy, TJ!

[Plats]

I have paid in 32 years - and by 67 - will have paid in 37. Plus - I have my 10 in the US, but due to their "windfall provision" - will get a reduced US payout. So all in - Japan, US, and of course my wife's - which is based solely on my income - it should exceed 200,000/month. That is - unless some restrictions get added between now and then. Fortunately - we do not need the pension, having saved ferociously over the years. By half - I meant "half of what it will take us to live on comfortably".

Congratulations! I wonder that since you have fulfilled the ten years needed for US Social Security, how would the US would know you have qualified for the Japanese pension, which would trigger WEP. Is there some statement you have to make?

[TJrandom]

Congratulations! I wonder that since you have fulfilled the ten years needed for US Social Security, how would the US would know you have qualified for the Japanese pension, which would trigger WEP. Is there some statement you have to make?

Tax returns will show that I have worked in Japan - even though the US SS system does not know this (or maybe they do - but it just does not show up on your SS statement). But when applying for US SS - the law is that you must inform them of any other program. Some of the teachers (state?) programs exempt them from paying into SS - and they have the same WEP requirements. Not sure of the penalty for lying when applying for SS - but I would not chance it.

[caramellocap]

Retirement… is just a few days away for me now. So I do believe I will be a less frequent visitor here for a while as I get settled into a new routine. I’ll be refocusing my energies on completing the move and transition from Tokyo living to country living, catching up on my hobbies, and maybe adding a couple.

I have been winding down my number of work days for a couple of years now and have our retirement home 99.9% complete. But I still have a home in Tokyo which I will either sell, or convert into a rental – either way it will take some doing and probably not be completed until the end of the year.

So my list of upcoming tasks includes:

Tokyo home cleanup/repair/rental or sale
Country home – minor outstanding tasks
Paint the barn & remodel the shop area for better utilization
Step up to well manage the garden – no longer tolerate the weeds
Step up to better manage the ornamental and fruit trees
Complete the Japanese nationality application (now almost done)
Spend more time with the grandkids and other relatives
Increase the number of honey bee apiaries and the number of hives at each
Better manage my golden girls (honey bees)
Ride more frequently
Take up fishing (after a 30 year lapse)
Travel more – aiming at a week twice a year outside of Japan and twice within

Do you have post retirement plans – or a good idea as to how you will be spending your time?

That's fantastic! Does it mean you won't be annoying younger people on here anymore? Sure hope so!

Good luck with renouncing US citizenship for Japanese - obviously you haven't heard of the delights in store for you from Obama and co who are intent on grabbing as much tax as possible from ordinary Americans especially those who renounce their citizenship. Of course a dummy like you wouldn't have even thought of reading up on the legislation enacted by Mr Hope and Change over the past few years.

All sorts of nasty surprises slipped into the legislation. But then again, you keep telling people to pay for things even when they are not forced to by law so you'll have no problem paying Uncle Barry for the privilege of renouncing your US citizenship. You can't be both American and Japanese according to Japanese law. Suck it up buddy!

[TJrandom]

That's fantastic! ...

Well thank you for your enthusiastic support. But really, you shouldn’t be stalking. Didn’t your mother teach you any manners? Go ahead and run on back to your unemployment benefits line – or you will miss out on the government teat this week.

[caramellocap]

Geez, I'm honoured that your posting time was a bit after 6am in the morning when the rest of us who have decent occupations were able to sleep.

Actually, I've never been on welfare in my life but thanks for informing me about how to get on it. Sorry, don't need it.

When Debbito got Japanese citizenship he could be sneaky and not inform the Yank authorities but it won't be the same for you, afraid not. Uncle Sam is desperate for cash and anyway for some time has been informed thru treaties etc of the happenings of American citizens abroad including in Japan.

It's got even worse under Obama - there have been clear statements by the IRS and other authorities that no matter what other passport American citizens obtain they can never cut ties completely with the US regarding tax and military service matters.

Getting another citizenship or renouncing US citizenship will lead to Uncle Sam also claiming a wonderful 30 percent tax as a kind of farewell penalty but it won't be a farewell as Uncle Sam will always regard you as one of the family and will ask Uncle Hideo what's up re your money matters.

Life's a biyotch but when it's so for biyotches you can't expect much sympathy. Too bad, so sad that Japanese nationalism will be the beginning instead of end of problems.

[TJrandom]

.... Uncle Sam is desperate for cash and anyway for some time has been informed thru treaties etc of the happenings of American citizens abroad including in Japan. ....

There is no need for the Japanese authorities to inform the US - I did this myself at the US embassy. And there is no tax penalty - since I pay my taxes everything is already taken care of.

[John Grey]

Our requirements were:

Excellent medical, good transportation, good shops & restaurants, close access to sea and mountains, bee (honey) friendly, larger than 600 tsubo, and vegi-garden-able.

As you seem to found exactly that... how much is something like in Chiba? Pacific side or Bay side?
We still live on the Yokosuka side of the Bay, but sooner or later....

[Super Grover]

Geez, I'm honoured that your posting time was a bit after 6am in the morning when the rest of us who have decent occupations were able to sleep.

Actually, I've never been on welfare in my life but thanks for informing me about how to get on it. Sorry, don't need it.

When Debbito got Japanese citizenship he could be sneaky and not inform the Yank authorities but it won't be the same for you, afraid not. Uncle Sam is desperate for cash and anyway for some time has been informed thru treaties etc of the happenings of American citizens abroad including in Japan.

It's got even worse under Obama - there have been clear statements by the IRS and other authorities that no matter what other passport American citizens obtain they can never cut ties completely with the US regarding tax and military service matters.

Getting another citizenship or renouncing US citizenship will lead to Uncle Sam also claiming a wonderful 30 percent tax as a kind of farewell penalty but it won't be a farewell as Uncle Sam will always regard you as one of the family and will ask Uncle Hideo what's up re your money matters.

Life's a biyotch but when it's so for biyotches you can't expect much sympathy. Too bad, so sad that Japanese nationalism will be the beginning instead of end of problems.

I'm Canadian. but I am interested in the portion I have put in bold and underlined. Is that accurate? An American who acquires another citizenship must pay a 30% tax? 30% of what? I don't know American law, but this seems odd. Are you referring to a leaving tax? At least in Canada, one must declare that one is leaving (a VERY, VERY, VERY DUMB) thing to do. Then they assess you with an outrageous, egregious 25% tax on your total net worth.

[TJrandom]

... An American who acquires another citizenship must pay a 30% tax? 30% of what? ...

There was a recent proposed law change in the US - which would have set the Capital Gains tax rate at 30% for anyone who was determined to be renouncing citizenship in order to avoid taxes. Not sure if it became law. It is not for someone who acquires a second nationality - but only for those who renounce US citizenship, and the US supports duals - so no problem there.

[TJrandom]

As you seem to found exactly that... how much is something like in Chiba? Pacific side or Bay side?
We still live on the Yokosuka side of the Bay, but sooner or later....

I am on the Pacific side – and as with all real estate – price depends upon location and opportunity. There was a recent tax auction of over 14,000 tsubo of nearby forest plus at least one rice field – no structures, no water/electricity service – but it did have good road access – and sold for yen 1.3mm. A friend was bidding on it so I abstained – but I’d say that was bottom priced, and of course each addition (water, etc.) would bring increases in prices. If you are interested – make a day trip out of it and waste some time with a realtor, and you will get a much better picture of prices and availability.

[John Grey]

I am on the Pacific side – and as with all real estate – price depends upon location and opportunity. There was a recent tax auction of over 14,000 tsubo of nearby forest plus at least one rice field – no structures, no water/electricity service – but it did have good road access – and sold for yen 1.3mm. A friend was bidding on it so I abstained – but I’d say that was bottom priced, and of course each addition (water, etc.) would bring increases in prices. If you are interested – make a day trip out of it and waste some time with a realtor, and you will get a much better picture of prices and availability.

Sounds like a good idea. There is a ferry in Kurihama, going of course to the Chiba Bay-side coast. I suppose public transport is not too widespread there, and its better to bring the car?

[TJrandom]

Sounds like a good idea. There is a ferry in Kurihama, going of course to the Chiba Bay-side coast. I suppose public transport is not too widespread there, and its better to bring the car?

Actually, public transportation is fairly good - given that most of Chiba is rural. But to do some sight seeing and investigate the areas around sites that a realtor might show you - then you would indeed need your own transport. That ferry is about yen 3,000 each way, so it is not prohibitively expensive. But if you are driving - the Aqua line might be even cheaper - at 800 each way.

[DP812]

I'm Canadian. but I am interested in the portion I have put in bold and underlined. Is that accurate? An American who acquires another citizenship must pay a 30% tax? 30% of what? I don't know American law, but this seems odd. Are you referring to a leaving tax? At least in Canada, one must declare that one is leaving (a VERY, VERY, VERY DUMB) thing to do. Then they assess you with an outrageous, egregious 25% tax on your total net worth.

The US allows for dual citizenship (although Japan doesn't), so it has nothing to do with whether or not you're a citizen of another country. It's an expatriation tax if you renounce your US citizenship. Here's what I found on Wikipedia about it (and since it is Wikipedia, I'm not sure if it's completely accurate):

Unlike most countries, the United States taxes its citizens on worldwide income, whether or not they are resident in the United States. To deter tax avoidance by abandonment of citizenship, the United States imposes an Expatriation Tax on those who abandon U.S. citizenship. The tax also applies to green-card holders who abandon U.S. permanent residence, if they have been resident for 8 of the last 15 years, whether or not they are emigrating to avoid tax.

The first law to authorize taxation of former citizens was passed in 1966; it created Internal Revenue Code Section 877, which allowed the U.S.-source income of former citizens to be taxed for up to 10 years following the date of their loss of citizenship. Section 877 was first amended in 1996, at a time when the issue of renunciation of U.S. citizenship for tax purposes was receiving a great deal of public attention; the same attention resulted in the passage of the Reed Amendment, which attempted to prevent former U.S. citizens from obtaining visas, but which was never enforced.[5][6] The American Jobs Creation act of 2004 amended Section 877 again.[7] Under the new law, any individual who had a net worth of $2 million or an average income tax liability of $139,000 for the five previous years[8] who renounces his or her citizenship is automatically assumed to have done so for tax avoidance reasons and is subject to additional taxes. Furthermore, with certain exceptions covered expatriates who spend at least 31 days in the United States in any year during the 10-year period following expatriation were subject to US taxation as if they were U.S. citizens or resident aliens.[9]

The HEART Act, passed on 17 June 2008, created the new Section 877A, which imposed a substantially different expatriation tax from that of the earlier Section 877.[6] Under the new expatriation tax law, effective for calendar year 2009, "covered expatriates", i.e. those who have a net worth of $2 million, or 5 year average income tax liability exceeding $139,000, are treated as if they had liquidated all of their assets on the date prior to their expatriation. Under this provision, the taxpayer's net gain is computed as if he or she had actually liquidated their assets. Net gain is the difference between the fair market value (theoretical selling price) and the taxpayer's cost basis (actual purchase price). Once net gain is calculated, any net gain greater than $600,000 will be taxed as income in that calendar year. The tax applies whether or not an actual sale is made by the taxpayer, and whether or not the notional gains arise on assets in the taxpayer's home country acquired before immigration to the United States. It is irrelevant that the gains may have partly arisen before the taxpayer moved to the U.S.

The new tax law also applies to deferred compensation ( 401(a), 403(b) plans, pension plans, stock options, etc.) of the expatriate. Traditional or regular IRAs are defined as specific tax deferred accounts rather than deferred compensation items. If the payer of the deferred compensation is a US citizen and the taxpayer expatriating has waived the right to a lower withholding rate[clarification needed], then the covered expatriate is charged a 30% withholding tax on their deferred compensation. If the covered expatriate does not meet the aforementioned criteria then the deferred compensation is taxed (as income) based on the present value of the deferred compensation.

So if I'm reading this correctly, the expatriation tax only applies if you're very well-off, because it's assumed you've renounced your citizenship for tax avoidance. Given that TJR has lived in Japan for a long time, I doubt the US government would assume that he's just now renouncing citizenship for tax avoidance reasons.