nuclear protests...

[miramira]

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2012/0...85S0R920120629

just read this, can someone describe how active the nuclear protests are in japan the moment?

[paradoxbox]

infrequent and completely ineffective

they happen about once a month through shibuya and harajuku on the standard demonstration route but nobody seems to pay attention anymore

[TheDoctor]

Even if the public did pay attention the politicians, bureaucrats and their handlers would ignore the protests and continue on their merry way.

[miramira]

infrequent and completely ineffective

they happen about once a month through shibuya and harajuku on the standard demonstration route but nobody seems to pay attention anymore

So how would you make it more effective?

[Yukkuri Kame]

Friday night was the largest protest of any sort in Japan in the last 50 years.

[wernst]

Friday night was the largest protest of any sort in Japan in the last 50 years.

yet it didn't achieve ____. Protesting doesn't work anymore these days. I think people really SHOULD go to the parliament and block the entrance or something. That would be more effective if not more amusing to see on the 11pm news.

[Yukkuri Kame]

yet it didn't achieve ____. Protesting doesn't work anymore these days. I think people really SHOULD go to the parliament and block the entrance or something. That would be more effective if not more amusing to see on the 11pm news.

It did achieve something very important - news coverage by every major news outlet in Japan (and many abroad) with the exception of Gomi-uri Shinbun. In a country where the entire family except the patient can know the patient is dying of cancer, breaking through the code of silence is a radical step. To the boob-toob watchers, the resistance is suddenly real. The Japanese are crowd-followers, and now there is a crowd to follow.

I agree that civil disobedience would be more entertaining than another friday sing along. That has been happening at Ooi and in Oita with the incineration of debris. Let the hard-core activists throw their bodies on the wheels of the machine over there. But I tend to believe the activists will make more inroads with the OL & salaryman crowd by keeping the Tokyo demonstrations non-threatening for now.

That the restart occurred will only worsen the perception that democracy in Japan has been hijacked and drive more people to protest.

[cucashopboy]

It did achieve something very important - news coverage by every major news outlet in Japan (and many abroad) with the exception of Gomi-uri Shinbun.

Yes, I noticed that - it was even shown on NHK for about 3 seconds. Before that, they've only shown Japanese people protesting against nasty American bases and those evil north Koreans. There has been a modest sea-change in peoples' thinking, protesting against Japan Inc. is no longer something only done by freaks, but I'm not holding my breath for any effect on government policy.

[paradoxbox]

the only thing that will wake people up is violent protests and mass rioting in tokyo.

definitely not ideal but japanese politicians will never listen. the demonstrators march past my building every sunday. the politicians don't even notice. if those demonstrators started tearing up and burning buildings and shops you can be damned sure the politicians would stop and think.

japanese people will never riot so there will never be change and there WILL be another nuclear accident.

and yes i do think this issue is worth violence. were are talking about serious potential global consequences and death on a large scale if another nuclear accident happens.

[Yukkuri Kame]

the only thing that will wake people up is violent protests and mass rioting in tokyo.

definitely not ideal but japanese politicians will never listen. the demonstrators march past my building every sunday. the politicians don't even notice. if those demonstrators started tearing up and burning buildings and shops you can be damned sure the politicians would stop and think.

japanese people will never riot so there will never be change and there WILL be another nuclear accident.

and yes i do think this issue is worth violence. were are talking about serious potential global consequences and death on a large scale if another nuclear accident happens.

Riots at this point would only result in the jackboot coming down and the protesters being marginalized. It plays right into the hands of the state, which can always win at violence.

Peaceful civil disobedience should be encouraged.

[wernst]

In other words we cant do anything so we should let government walk allover us,

The main problem is , that I dont dare to protest or do actions like that is that they can kick me out.

One of the rules for a PR or so i read somewhere is that you are NOT allowed in any case to oppose the government or its ideas or you will lose your PR and booted out of Japan. where did I read that?

[miramira]

if the various 'zengakuren' group like Kakumaru-ha or chukaku-ha started leading the movement, it would die overnigh. the helmet clad zengakuren looked cool back in the 60s/70s. but its completely out of date now, and they're a bunch of troksyist/stalinist extremists, who have very little relationship to normal people.

[Yukkuri Kame]

In other words we cant do anything so we should let government walk allover us,

Not at all. If Ghandi could defeat the British Empire, anti-nuke protesters certainly have a chance to topple the incompetents in charge now.

What about Martin Luther King?

Womens suffrage came about through non-violent means.

More recently we have the Icelandic revolution, which has resulted in a government toppled, bankers thrown in jail, politicians standing trial and forgiveness of vast majority of mortgage debt.

What are the advances for society that have come about through rioting? When has it been effective at changing anything? As miramira points out, the last time that was tried in Japan, it did not end well.

The main problem is , that I dont dare to protest or do actions like that is that they can kick me out.

One of the rules for a PR or so i read somewhere is that you are NOT allowed in any case to oppose the government or its ideas or you will lose your PR and booted out of Japan. where did I read that?

Then protest quietly to your friends or anonymously online. Many of the most powerful revolutionary writings have historically been anonymously written pamphlets that were distributed. Design or print flyers.

[paradoxbox]

or gain japanese citizenship and become an activist

or become a secret coordinator of activists, if it's that important an issue to you.

it's not worth it for me to get involved, i'll let the japanese government bury itself without my help.

india won over the british empire because the british empire actually had ethics and intelligence, eventually they could be reasoned with.

japanese politicians are useless and there is no hope. the japanese political system is literally completely imbred - EVERYONE in politics here has a politician family member. their political ideology is indoctrinated from childhood, it can't be changed. that's why i think, unfortunately, violence and riots are the only way to force change.

politicians don't have any fear now. regardless of what actions they take they have nothing to lose. if they had something to lose they might take the plight of the world more seriously. just how much more radioactive dust does the rest of the world have to endure because of these f*ckwits?

[Guru]

Are those protesters getting paid by doing that? I would rather use my paid holidays for other purposes (mostly outside of Japan).

[miramira]

a flashmob, or a fit down is good way of making peaceful protesters punch bags for the cops, i've never really worked out if it helps, but its all good TV and it adds a ____ load of fuel to the fire.

[TheDoctor]

the only thing that will wake people up is violent protests and mass rioting in tokyo.

Where you not one of the people to describe the Japanese as sheep? Sheep are not known for biting, kicking or goring people.

japanese people will never riot so there will never be change and there WILL be another nuclear accident.

and yes i do think this issue is worth violence. were are talking about serious potential global consequences and death on a large scale if another nuclear accident happens.

Another nuclear incident or accident will be all to the good I think. The reactors at Oi are PWR's which are similar in design to what powered the old Polaris subs. They, unfortunately, can take a lot of abuse. Let's hope the next series of reactors to be restarted are the more touchy and dangerous BWR's.

[miramira]

So whens the next big demo in tokyo?
does anyone have any links to websites etc? japanese websites are fine...

[well_bicyclically]

So whens the next big demo in tokyo?
does anyone have any links to websites etc? japanese websites are fine...

the next big demonstration in Tokyo will be later this week. There is a movement to increase the number allowed inside the Coach Leather stores, and increase the number of staff so that everyone can enjoy shopping equally!

[Yukkuri Kame]

You don't even need a spine to practice civil disobedience:

http://enenews.com/large-outbreak-of...ion-of-reactor

[Esc]

It's BECAUSE of these people that we're in this mess!

Where were those 20,000+ demonstrators after any of the numerous nuclear disasters around the world?

Where were those 20,000+ demonstrators at the construction sites of the Japanese nuclear power plants?

Not a single F was given on any day or week, month or year after the NRX (Canada) disaster in 1952, the Scotland (United Kingdom) disaster in 1967, the Three Mile Island (USA) diaster in 1979, the Tsuruga (Japan) disaster in 1981, the Chernobyl (Ukraine) disaster in 1986, the Normandy (France) disaster also in 1986, the Hamm-Uentrop (Germany) disaster also in 1986, the New York (USA) disaster in 2005, the Kashiwazaki (Japan) disaster in 2007 and numerous accidents and close calls like them.

Instead, these protestors basically allowed Japanese power companies (with political backing) to build more nuclear power plants AFTER those disasters!

Hell, they even paid for them!

And then there's of course the inconvenient truth that these protestors are shouting political slogans (No Noda! etc) against Prime Minister Noda and his party (Democratic Party Japan) while it's in fact the Liberal Democratic Party who endorsed building those unstable nuclear reactors, starting in 1954 by then LDP Prime Minister Ichiro Hatoyama who happens to be the grandfather of yet another LDP ex-PM Yukio Hatoyama (2009).