Where did I go wrong?

[StarfoxPro]

I knew 1050 Kanjis, 5000+ words, did a half a book of 2kyu 読解, and still flunked the 2kyu test. Granted my grammar was a bit weak. Knowing this much information, I should have aced it. Instead, I crashed and burned. The real problem was that I ran out of time. The reading took me almost the entire time leaving little time to answer the Kanji, vocab and grammar questions. When they said I had one minute left I still had a whole column of answers left to do. The listening I seemed to do OK with.

I suppose the big question is: Where did I go wrong?

The next question is: what constructive suggestions does anyone have?

[Koenji]

It's obvious: the reading. It's a big chunk of the exam. The trick is to read not just accurately but quickly.

[inflames]

You studied individual things and not everything together (reading, basically). Part of a test is knowing the material, the rest is knowing how to take the test.

My suggestion is to read. Also, buy all the practice test books and practice with them (don't write the answers in the book but rather on a separate sheet so you can reuse the book) and practice those a lot.

[StarfoxPro]

You studied individual things and not everything together (reading, basically). Part of a test is knowing the material, the rest is knowing how to take the test.

My suggestion is to read. Also, buy all the practice test books and practice with them (don't write the answers in the book but rather on a separate sheet so you can reuse the book) and practice those a lot.

I did study reading, although probably not long enough. The reading is where it all comes together.

I probably know enough Kanjis to read a news paper and manga (I think). Can you read a news paper and manga with 1000 kanjis? I will try that for some real reading versus just the text books all the time.

I also think a whole language approach is probably in order especially for 2 kyu. I also used some older 2 kyu books when I should probably be using N2. I believe that N2 is harder than the old 2kyu.

Thanks for your help

[wernst]

you did 2kyu and you only knew a 1000 kanji? wtf.

I thought for 2kyu you need to know at least 1500+

[kurogane]

Even allowing for differences in study habits and personal inclinations, etc., I always recommend that anything beyond the practice books and tests is to be considered background study.

It isn't a test of your ability, per se; it's a test of how well you can take a test that they (wrongly) presume is a test of your actual Japanese ability.

I got a perfect mark on the old style National University Entrance Exam (cica 1995), not because my Japanese was overwhelmingly good, but because all I did in preparation was study the practice tests. Nothing else. And when I did guess on the test, I guessed right.

Also, yeah, like somebody else said, if you can't read at that level, even if you have all the component parts, you won't pass. Mostly due to time constraints.

It sounds to me as you have the mechanics, but not the organics.

Work on the latter, and the former will follow. Is that what you mean by a Hole Language Appoach?


Just start reading stuff you like to read.

Except Manga.

Unless you're still 13 and a slow developer

[Trichophyton-in-my-pants]

Do not read the whole text in the reading part. In general, you only need to find a specific passage in the text to answer correctly. You don't even need extra info from the text to figure out the trick questions. Furthermore, if I recall correctly, the reading part amounts to much less in terms of score than the remaining grammar and vocabulary. (Also, keep in mind that the majority of test takers have a native language using kanji, so the tests are geared towards them rather than catering to white folk who don't know what the squiggly things are from momma's milk. Hence the exhaustive reading part.)

And, the Japanese tests surely don't test your Japanese ability, but ability to take tests.

[wernst]

So what most of you are saying is that taking a JLPT test means f00k all?

[Effected After]

One thing that I find that helps is to read the questions before the passage. That way I know what information I need to find while I'm reading the article.

[kurogane]

One thing that I find that helps is to read the questions before the passage. That way I know what information I need to find while I'm reading the article.

Ooooh!

Very nice point.

It amazles me how some of deez kidz don't know that stuff as much as we were taught.

Actually reading a Jpn book on how to take a Jpn test might even be a good idea, both as prep, and as study.


Also, seducing the lonely spinster that guards the current year's test scores and wheedling a copy out of her in exchange for some skanky supply room sex could work, too.

[Trichophyton-in-my-pants]

So what most of you are saying is that taking a JLPT test means f00k all?

Passing a JLPT test means that you paid money and passed a JLPT test.

On a sidenote, I know an amazing amount of Chinese guys who have the JLPT 1 in the pocket, but have the conversational ability of a stalking mukade.

[Duymon]

Passing a JLPT test means that you paid money and passed a JLPT test.

On a sidenote, I know an amazing amount of Chinese guys who have the JLPT 1 in the pocket, but have the conversational ability of a stalking mukade.

JLPT just lets you get your foot in the door at some places. For the most part the real language ability is shown during your interview and your e-mail correspondence.

Hell, I work for a Japanese telecom in the US, deal with all japanese co-workers and customers and I don't even have a single JLPT cert.

[StarfoxPro]

Passing a JLPT test means that you paid money and passed a JLPT test.

On a sidenote, I know an amazing amount of Chinese guys who have the JLPT 1 in the pocket, but have the conversational ability of a stalking mukade.

You are right and that is why they changed it in 2010. Hence it went from 2kyu to N2. You have to pass EACH SECTION now with 60% or better to pass the test. You can overall 60% or better and still not pass if you flunk any one section. The was one of the reasons they changed it. The old version totally favored the Chinese.

Also in the N1 and N2 they took the 語彙　漢字 and combined it with 文法　読解　and made it one long section. I had 105 minutes to answer 75 questons. On　the N5, N4 and N3 there are still 3 sections.

As far as Kanji goes, I had 1050 Kanjis and there were still Kanjis that came up that I never seen before. Many textbooks now recommend 1200 Kanjis, Which I agree with.

As far as not not reading the whole section, you kind of have to especially when they ask questions like:

この文章の内容と合うものはどれか？

I agree if they ask a content specific questions you can get away with not reading the whole thing. But they ask questiosn like the one above, (and they come up a lot) it is hard not to answer without reading the whole thing.

[Andun]

I probably know enough Kanjis to read a news paper and manga (I think). Can you read a news paper and manga with 1000 kanjis? I will try that for some real reading versus just the text books all the time.

It's not so much the number of kanji, but the number of kanji compounds you know which will determine your reading ability. That being said, 1000 kanji is not enough to read a newspaper. Knowing 1000 kanji puts you roughly at the level of a 9 year old. That's all.

[Effected After]

Yeah, I probably know around 1500 kanji or so, and I can only somewhat read a newspaper article. There are always a number of words (compounds) that I don't know. So I get the story, but I usually miss a few of the small points.

[Genkii]

One thing that I find that helps is to read the questions before the passage. That way I know what information I need to find while I'm reading the article.

[Koenji]

I think many of the comments above refer to the old test. The revamp is more practical in nature: greater weight given to reading and listening of usually common topics. However, the test is also more demanding.

Anyone know why they keep making it more difficult?

[inflames]

I did study reading, although probably not long enough. The reading is where it all comes together.

I probably know enough Kanjis to read a news paper and manga (I think). Can you read a news paper and manga with 1000 kanjis? I will try that for some real reading versus just the text books all the time.

I also think a whole language approach is probably in order especially for 2 kyu. I also used some older 2 kyu books when I should probably be using N2. I believe that N2 is harder than the old 2kyu.

Thanks for your help

How can one "study reading?" One can certainly practice reading but studying reading seems a bit difficult. The point I was trying to make was that you need to go out and read things to prepare for the reading (as this then prepares you to answer the questions) then do practice tests in order to practice answering the questions. Reading is probably the easiest thing to prepare for - simply go out, buy a book, and start reading it on the train.

I thought that the JLPT readings weren't difficult because of the level but rather because they were usually just really boring. The J-Test actually had interesting readings.

BTW you don't need a 60% on each section to pass but rather 20% on each section.