Kojin Jigyo and Visa

[inmyth]

Hello,

I am currently on engineering visa and employed at a company in Tokyo. However I will quit and start my own business soon. I am thinking about doing a web development company or online shop and I will go with sole proprietorship aka kojin jigyo since I don't really need any staff at the moment. I heard that registering a kojin jigyo is pretty straightforward but I would like to know if I can use my kojin jigyo business to secure a visa ?

[nynapaj]

No. You can't. I have been down that road and it is just a whole bunch of "no" from everyone. In my case, I am just being patient. I will apply for PR soon, and once I get it, I can do all the independent business stuff I want.

If you want to run the business on the side, you might be okay depending on how you swing it and how much money it makes.
If you want to do your business full time, you need a visa for entrepreneurs.

[nynapaj]

ps. You can open your Kojin Jigyo legally anytime. That is not the problem. The question starts when you make a profit and when you want to report it as a job on your visa application.
If you have other questions just call immigration about it... do it from a pay phone and fake a different voice if you are really scared.

[inmyth]

Hi thanks for you reply nynapaj. I talked with two visa attorneys and they said what you said: no it's not possible. And although a corporate can be set up with one yen, foreigners are expected to have 5 millions in starting capital to be eligible for business visa. It's some sort of unwritten immigration rule.
But back to the kojin jigyo thing, what would be its benefit if I start it with my current status as an employee ? My tax filling is done by my company and I would still not get a visa after I quit. My libertarian inner side screams when my hard earned penny goes to a govt which is not even friendly to us gaijins.

[gormless_entrepreneur]

What about using the (regular) income from a kojin jigyo as part of the earnings required to meet the 250000 yen+ per month required for self-sponsorship? As long as you had a couple of other jobs, had proof of paying tax on a wage above 250000, and had been in Japan for a few years, would this be enough to continue working in the country without the blessing of a company?

[wzwzwz]

You can get a business investor visa even if your company is a sole proprietorship.

You need at least 5 million yen in seen capital and the ability to employ 2 Japanese people full-time though.

[inmyth]

I just came up with a same idea, gormless. So there was this guy who showed 3 eikaiwa job contracts to the immigration office promising to give him a total of 250k yen and he managed to get his visa. I guess if I work as a contractor (with lower pay but more time for myself) while using my kojin jigyo income to reach 250k yen level I should be able to get a visa too.
Could anyone confirm this ?

[greatwugawuga]

inmyth, I have done that myself. My income from my part-time job was only 150,000/month. I provided proof of that job along with my income tax return showing my income from my small business (kojin jigyo). That was last year, and I had no probs at all getting a 3-year visa. BTW, a visa lawyer that I contacted said it wouldn't be a problem either.

[inmyth]

Thanks for the info greatwugawuga. What kind of visa did you get ? I assume it's a normal work visa ?

[spike7165]

I just came up with a same idea, gormless. So there was this guy who showed 3 eikaiwa job contracts to the immigration office promising to give him a total of 250k yen and he managed to get his visa. I guess if I work as a contractor (with lower pay but more time for myself) while using my kojin jigyo income to reach 250k yen level I should be able to get a visa too.
Could anyone confirm this ?

This guy had 3 important pieces of paper "contracts". There's no problem having 3 jobs after the first year, but IM law says you must have a "contract with a private or public organization" thats a requirement of a working non entrepeneur visa. So a Kojin Jigyo won't work because you won't have a contract i.e employment agreement.

Also with regard to the guy who used his kojin jigyo income, he either a) had permission from immigration to do non-contractural work and yes you do need this even for teaching private lessons or b) he got away with it. I wouldn't advise b as I got told off...

My advice get a full time job or 2-3 contracts doing other work, do your kojin jigyo on the side but you do need permission. If you don't get it and the business grows then you get to a point where it is big enough for the entrpreneur visa you are going to get some tough questions about how it suddenly got so big when they didn't know about it!!!

[greatwugawuga]

Yes, it is a normal working visa. I haven't sought permission from immigration, and that's the first I've heard of requiring permission. Perhaps I did get lucky, but no questions at all were asked and I was very clear to them about what I was doing. They didn't bat an eyelid.

[trip_hop]

Yes, it is a normal working visa. I haven't sought permission from immigration, and that's the first I've heard of requiring permission. Perhaps I did get lucky, but no questions at all were asked and I was very clear to them about what I was doing. They didn't bat an eyelid.

The joy of case-by-case decisions!

There is little consistency in the answers from staff at Immigration, which sometimes can work in your favour, and other times work against you...

[spike7165]

Triphop's right but if you're thinking about doing your own thing do you really want to take the risk of putting your kojin jigyo down on the forms then they ask you why you're breaking the law?

I think it comes down to how much of your income it accounts for as well. I believe that if you have a regular full time job on a decent salary, then as long as your part time kojin jigyo is within the terms of your status of residence IM don't much care. If however, it accounts for more than half of your income, I think you'd have problems.

[nynapaj]

inmyth, I have done that myself. My income from my part-time job was only 150,000/month. I provided proof of that job along with my income tax return showing my income from my small business (kojin jigyo).

Is the job and the small business in the same field???

I have heard they are lenient if you say, "70% is from teaching English as an employee, and 30% is from private students.", but they get strict if it's "70% is from teaching English as an employee, and 30% is from importing ABC."

[greatwugawuga]

yes, same field, so you may be correct.

[vinavisa]

No. You can't. I have been down that road and it is just a whole bunch of "no" from everyone. In my case, I am just being patient. I will apply for PR soon, and once I get it, I can do all the independent business stuff I want.

If you want to run the business on the side, you might be okay depending on how you swing it and how much money it makes.
If you want to do your business full time, you need a visa for entrepreneurs.

the answer is no. i am so sorry.

[nynapaj]

the answer is no. i am so sorry.

Huih? WTF?

[well_bicyclically]

Huih? WTF?

the previous poster is just spamming for vietnam visa.org.... whatever that is.
she love you long time.