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Do I absolutely have to pay the pension (nenkin)?

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  • Do I absolutely have to pay the pension (nenkin)?

    I just signed up for Kokukmin kenko hoken (japanese national health) at my local ward office. Unfortunately, they now know that I haven't been paying the nenkin (national pension). I managed to leave the office today without signing up for it, but I am worried that now they know where I live, they will come after me and ask me to pay the pension payment. I really dont want to pay the pension because it's expensive, it is likely to be very little by the time I retire in 40 years, I may not even retire in Japan, and I have heard many people in Japan don't pay it. I have heard that an increasing number of people just throw away their nenkin bills, because they know the aging population and mismanagement of the pension scheme will result in tiny payouts in future.
    However, I don't want to get thrown out of Japan or lose my visa, and I will pay the nenkin if absolutely have to. Is there any way I can respectfully decline, or avoid paying it? What should I do if they send me letters, bills and start making phone calls to my home, regarding the nenkin?
    None of the other teachers at my school pay the nenkin, kokumin-kenko-hoken, or the shakai hoken (combination of the two) because we officially work under 30 hours. Is this a valid excuse for not paying it?
    Thanks for any advice, and I hope I don't sound like a totally dishonest tax dodger!

  • #2
    Originally posted by c233sz View Post
    None of the other teachers at my school pay the nenkin, kokumin-kenko-hoken, or the shakai hoken (combination of the two) because we officially work under 30 hours. Is this a valid excuse for not paying it?
    Thanks for any advice, and I hope I don't sound like a totally dishonest tax dodger!
    They will not call you, they will not send men around with baseball bats and they wont kick you out of Japan.

    All it means is you will get nothing back in 25 years.

    Half of Japan does not pay nenkin either.

    PS Nenkin is not a tax.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by KansaiBen View Post
      Half of Japan does not pay nenkin either.
      Slight exaggeration, I suspect.

      Anyway, please pay it. I have paid into the nenkin for 15 years and only have 10 years to go before I will be eligible to receive a pension, when the time comes.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Since1990 View Post
        Slight exaggeration, I suspect.

        Anyway, please pay it. I have paid into the nenkin for 15 years and only have 10 years to go before I will be eligible to receive a pension, when the time comes.
        According to this report over 5,000,000 people in Japan are currently behind in their payments and the Pension Agency has hired an army of people to track them down.

        年金保険料 徴収態勢を強化へ
        12月26日 4時21分
        厚生労働省は、自営業者らが加入している国民年金の保 険料の納付率が低下していることを受けて、
        来年度から保険料を強制的に徴収する業務を専門に行う 職員を460人採用し、納付率の向上を
        目指すことになりました。

        自営業者らが加入している国民年金は、年金制度への信 頼が低下していることなどから、昨年度の
        保険料の納付率は60%と、4年連続で過去最低を更新しています 。

        これを受けて厚生労働省は、500万円以上の所得があ るにもかかわらず、長期間、保険料を滞納している
        悪質なケースを対象に、強制的に保険料を徴収する業務を専門に行 う職員を来年度460人採用することに
        なりました。

        採用された職員は全国の年金事務所に配属され、対象者 に支払いを求める督促状を送り、それでも
        従わなかった場合には、銀行の預金口座や売上金を差し押 さえます。また厚生労働省は、所得が
        1000万円以上あるのに滞納している、さらに悪質なケースについては、税金の徴収のノウハウを
        持っている国税庁に強制的な徴収を委任する準備も進め ており、こうした取り組みや、はがきによる
        納付の呼びかけを通じて、納付率の向上を目指すことにしています。
        http://www3.nhk.or.jp/news/html/2010...075771000.html

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by c233sz View Post
          I just signed up for Kokukmin kenko hoken (japanese national health) at my local ward office. Unfortunately, they now know that I haven't been paying the nenkin (national pension). I managed to leave the office today without signing up for it, but I am worried that now they know where I live, they will come after me and ask me to pay the pension payment. I really dont want to pay the pension because it's expensive, it is likely to be very little by the time I retire in 40 years, I may not even retire in Japan, and I have heard many people in Japan don't pay it. I have heard that an increasing number of people just throw away their nenkin bills, because they know the aging population and mismanagement of the pension scheme will result in tiny payouts in future.
          None of the other teachers at my school pay the nenkin, kokumin-kenko-hoken, or the shakai hoken (combination of the two) because we officially work under 30 hours. Is this a valid excuse for not paying it?
          Thanks for any advice, and I hope I don't sound like a totally dishonest tax dodger!

          How long do you plan to be here and where do you come from? If you come from the U.S., every year you are here is a blank year on your Social Security record. Nenkin payments here are now counted by the U.S.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by KansaiBen View Post
            昨年度の
            保険料の納付率は60%と、4年連続で過去最低を更新しています 。
            ワット??!!!
            40% aren't paying?? What do they expect to do when they retire. I doubt that all of them (and perhaps hardly any of them) would have a decent amount of savings stashed.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Since1990 View Post
              ワット??!!!
              40% aren't paying?? What do they expect to do when they retire. I doubt that all of them (and perhaps hardly any of them) would have a decent amount of savings stashed.
              Would YOU trust the government here with your money?

              I sure as hell wouldn't. They can't even manage a cake stand let alone a pension scheme.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by KansaiBen View Post
                Would YOU trust the government here with your money?

                I sure as hell wouldn't. They can't even manage a cake stand let alone a pension scheme.
                So, you don't pay it either?

                I have never worked outside of Japan, so I will not be eligible to receive a pension from the New Zealand government, so I have no choice. It is also company policy (of course) to pay it where I work.

                The nenkin is actually not for yourself, it's for the elderly who are alive now. If it runs out, it runs out.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by KansaiBen View Post
                  They will not call you, they will not send men around with baseball bats and they wont kick you out of Japan.

                  All it means is you will get nothing back in 25 years.

                  Half of Japan does not pay nenkin either.

                  PS Nenkin is not a tax.
                  Hmmm.. I heard that the National Health Insurance has recently been designated as a tax. That way they can seize your property. Wouldn't surprise me if they try to do the same thing with nenkin. Scary stuff 'cuz I've not paid insurance for the last 3 years and have never paid nenkin.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    If you're from a country with a pension agreement, it may well be worth paying. Also, the gov't is considering reducing the 25 year minimum requirement, say to 15 or 10 years. So in a best-case scenario, your payments now in Japan would contribute to 2 pensions in your old age. Not a bad deal, considering the payments are only 15,000 a month.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by KansaiBen View Post
                      According to this report over 5,000,000 people in Japan are currently behind in their payments and the Pension Agency has hired an army of people to track them down.
                      Well I can point them in the direction of one non-payer so that's only 4,999,999 to go.

                      Polemically,
                      A.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by KansaiBen View Post
                        Half of Japan does not pay nenkin either.
                        There are only 10 million people in Japan? Wow. That shrinking population sure did sneak up fast on everyone. Yet the trains are still damn crowded...

                        Nitpickingly,
                        A.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Thanks for all the information!

                          Thanks a lot for all the information. I had no idea so many people read these forums! I was hoping that someone could tell me the official punishment for non payment. Or have you heard from any friends who have got into trouble over it?
                          If 'Kansai Ben' is correct in his facts, there is no punishment whatsoever. If nenkin is not taken from your paycheck in the form of 'shakai hoken', then it is merely a voluntary scheme, and not a tax at all. Although I sympathize with the guy has been paying it, I have to think about my future, and it would make much more sense for me to put $150 (per month for 30 years) into some kind of savings scheme. There is a good chance I could be here in my old age, and buying a house seems like a far more secure way of protecting my future.

                          please keep the comments coming

                          PS- I am a UK citizen so I suppose I could pay into the Uk pension scheme. Does anyone know if there is a pension sharing agreement between Japan and the UK?
                          Last edited by c233sz; 2012-08-10, 12:08 PM.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Officially I'm in arrears but the Pension office simply sends me a postcard every month, no phone calls, no follow up.

                            In fact I went to see the pension office a couple of months ago and asked for a reduction in payments which was turned down. So even they know I'm behind they do nothing.

                            My best advice is set up a private pension plan with an offshore account or a managed fund through a financial investment company. I had one for about 15 years.

                            Dont listen to people like Agitator.



                            Originally posted by c233sz View Post
                            Thanks a lot for all the information. I had no idea so many people read these forums! I was hoping that someone could tell me the official punishment for non payment. Or have you heard from any friends who have got into trouble over it?
                            If 'Kansai Ben' is correct in his facts, there is no punishment whatsoeve- If nenkin is not taken from your paycheck in the form of 'shakai hoken', then it is merely a voluntary scheme, and not a tax at all. Although I sympathize with the guy has been paying it, I have to think about my future, and it would make much more sense for me to put $150 into some kind of savings scheme. There is a good chance I could be here in old age, but buying a house seems like a far more secure way of protecting my future.

                            please keep the comments coming

                            PS- I am a UK citizen so I suppose I could pay into the uk pension scheme. Is there a pension sharing agreement between Japan and the UK?

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by KansaiBen View Post
                              Officially I'm in arrears but the Pension office simply sends me a postcard every month, no phone calls, no follow up.

                              In fact I went to see the pension office a couple of months ago and asked for a reduction in payments which was turned down. So even they know I'm behind they do nothing.
                              Well you were the one who posted an article about the government stepping up its enforcement. So what exactly is your point?

                              For the record, I agree that it is likely nothing will ever happen to those who don't pay, other than being unable to claim pension benefits. But, as usual, you're the one out there tossing around conflicting information and confusing people.

                              Dont listen to people like Agitator.
                              Except where I am cleaning up your mess.

                              To the OP - the point is rules change, or at least the enforcement of them can change. You can probably get away without paying now, but that is no guarantee you'll get away with it in the future. The government pension fund is going to run dry one of these days; you can't expect the government will take it lying down. Also, please note that the actions taken by KansaiBen are usually a good example of how not to manage your affairs.

                              Typically,
                              A.

                              Comment

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