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Leaving Japan indefinitely while keeping PR status

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  • #16
    Originally posted by WIJ View Post
    Possibly being naive, but i thought only NZ and USA try to tax people outside of the country.

    NZ and as far as I'm aware, the US have tax treaties with Japan to ensure you don't get double taxed. If you earn over US$86,000 in Japan you will get taxed any amount over that figure (so I hear) which is a small minority of people. Americans still have to file a tax return on their Japan earnings to the IRS but doesnt actually mean they pay any taxes on it.

    I'm a Kiwi, lived here 25 years and have not paid a cent to NZ on my Japan earnings, only on what I earn in NZ (real estate).

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Effected After View Post
      It's permanent 'residence'. If you are out of the country for five years, it's unlikely that they will consider you a resident, though you *may* be able to slip through the cracks. That said, you'll be liable for pension for that five years, as well as taxes and the like, though taxes and health insurance will be quite low since you won't any income in the country.
      Thanks. Yeah - that looks about right -- we'll probably be paying into the wife's pension monthly (although last time we left she was able to get a break from paying for 5 years.) Considering taxes and whatnot, though, I really need to go and talk to the city hall folks and get the lowdown. I was hoping someone else had tried this.

      More than likely this won't work.

      But hey, Glenski -- nothing wrong with having your cake and eating it, too, as long as it doesn't hurt anyone. And what a silly expression that is: who doesn't want to eat the cake they have?

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      • #18
        Originally posted by WIJ View Post
        Possibly being naive, but i thought only NZ and USA try to tax people outside of the country.
        I thought it was just the US, don't tell NZ, too?

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Effected After View Post
          The whole REP thing is irrelevant anyways, as the system won't exist anymore in three months.
          I believe they'll still exist (and be required) for absences of more than 1 year from Japan.

          Concurrently,
          A.

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          • #20
            Yeah it sounds that way from this thread.

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            • #21
              Update

              Talked to both immigration and the local city hall folks. It turns out that once I do the paperwork to declare I'm no longer residing in Japan, they will not charge me for taxes or health insurance while I am away.

              They will also not take away my PR status or my ARC at airport immigration provided I have a re-entry permit.

              So yes, I can have my cake and eat it, too.

              Good news for other PR holders out there. If you are leaving Japan and have any inkling of perhaps moving back some day, just visit once within your re-entry permit period and keep your PR status.

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              • #22
                Good luck! Report back in five years when you come to renew, to let us know how it went.

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                • #23
                  Sure. But I'll be back for a visit in under 3 years -- leaving in June before the new policy comes into effect.
                  It's nice to be able to keep the PR status so I can live here again without the hassle of applying for a new visa.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by horrified View Post
                    Glenski - Going back to get the kids in public school back home for a few years. I own a house here and plan to come back, but I don't think it will be for at least 7 years.
                    You might have said this initially and attracted less fire. Less speculation on our part.

                    But hey, Glenski -- nothing wrong with having your cake and eating it, too, as long as it doesn't hurt anyone.
                    The people you "hurt" would be the ones to benefit from your paying taxes and health insurance, etc. You aren't the first person to ask this type of question, but I don't recall what others have said about the results. I suspected you'll be able to suspend health insurance, but if you own a house, chances are you might still have to pay taxes. Looks like you got what you wanted, though.

                    As for pension, if you stop paying into it, you will lose the chance to collect earlier.

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Glenski View Post
                      You might have said this initially and attracted less fire. Less speculation on our part.

                      The people you "hurt" would be the ones to benefit from your paying taxes and health insurance, etc. You aren't the first person to ask this type of question, but I don't recall what others have said about the results. I suspected you'll be able to suspend health insurance, but if you own a house, chances are you might still have to pay taxes. Looks like you got what you wanted, though.

                      As for pension, if you stop paying into it, you will lose the chance to collect earlier.
                      I'm really not sure why you insist on being so negative Glenski.

                      Your argument is really quite ridiculous. If he and his family are living in another country and using that health system and paying health insurance and taxes there, how on earth does that affect anyone in Japan. They won't be using the Japanese system, so why should they have to pay into the system?
                      When they come back to Japan after how ever many years they will then become resident again in Japan and start using and paying into the Japanese system.


                      Anyone who has PR has obviously been here a long time and has been paying taxes, health insurance etc all that time - and doing their bit to support the mess that is the Japanese social system.

                      And - anyone who owns property in their "home" country knows that the property tax obligation doesn't go away just because you are not resident. Why should Japan be any different.
                      It's a completely separate issue.

                      I would like to thank the OP for letting us know what the procedure is in this case. I'm sure I'm not the only one who has considered a move and wondered if it is possible to keep PR.

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                      • #26
                        Kansaiben - It would seem that you didn't actually read what the OP WROTE:
                        Originally posted by horrified View Post
                        Talked to both immigration and the local city hall folks. It turns out that once I do the paperwork to declare I'm no longer residing in Japan, they will not charge me for taxes or health insurance while I am away.

                        They will also not take away my PR status or my ARC at airport immigration provided I have a re-entry permit.

                        So yes, I can have my cake and eat it, too.

                        Good news for other PR holders out there. If you are leaving Japan and have any inkling of perhaps moving back some day, just visit once within your re-entry permit period and keep your PR status.
                        So he went and asked the relevant authorities and found out that yes he could in fact suspend his tax and health insurance payments ( and presumably so can his wife). There is obviously a mechanism that allows people to do this legally.

                        I'm not sure why you then say that the Japanese system is not designed that way. It seems to be that you are just making things up based on your own opinions without any real facts.

                        I don't argue with the fact that the US is worse than Japan, but Japan has a lot of problems waiting to happen. It is however irrelevant to this thread.

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by possum View Post
                          I'm not sure why you then say that the Japanese system is not designed that way. It seems to be that you are just making things up based on your own opinions without any real facts.
                          This is his SOP. He makes guesses based on how he thinks thing should be, and phrase them as fact. Sometimes he's right but usually that's usually just coincidence, not actually based in any knowledge of these facts. It's fairly rare that he actually knows what he's talking about.

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Effected After View Post
                            This is his SOP. He makes guesses based on how he thinks thing should be, and phrase them as fact. Sometimes he's right but usually that's usually just coincidence, not actually based in any knowledge of these facts. It's fairly rare that he actually knows what he's talking about.
                            Well it is completely irresponsible!

                            I was reading this thread because I really wanted to know if it was actually possible to keep PR when living outside Japan for a while, and if so what happened with taxes and health insurance.

                            If posters don't know for sure they should refrain from posting. There is nothing more annoying than someone presenting false information as fact.

                            It was even more annoying when the OP actually got accurate information from the source ( immigration and city hall ) only to be told that he was wrong. Immigration is wrong? City Hall is wrong?

                            And if Immigration and City Hall allow something tht should be end of it. No moralising necessary.

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by horrified View Post
                              Talked to both immigration and the local city hall folks. It turns out that once I do the paperwork to declare I'm no longer residing in Japan, they will not charge me for taxes or health insurance while I am away.

                              They will also not take away my PR status or my ARC at airport immigration provided I have a re-entry permit.

                              So yes, I can have my cake and eat it, too.

                              Good news for other PR holders out there. If you are leaving Japan and have any inkling of perhaps moving back some day, just visit once within your re-entry permit period and keep your PR status.
                              Very informative, thanks for posting.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by KansaiBen
                                Because the Japanese system is not designed to suspend monthly payments because one chooses to live out of the country. If you do not pay you are technically in default on your payments and it becomes money that you owe before you can claim on your medical expenses.

                                If he comes back here after seven years he will owe up to two years of back payments before he can use his health insurance.
                                absolute nonsense.

                                hypothetical example for you (that means I made it up to match your made-up statements)

                                Single Japanese guy been working for his Japanese company in Japan earning yen paying taxes, shakai hoken payments to the Japanese government gets told he is being transferring to his company's American office for three years. (chose America since it should be a made-up example you can follow).

                                Our guy is now earning American dollars, paying American dollar taxes and other random insurance deductions to the American government.

                                Are you honestly saying that you think our guy should not only be paying his taxes and insurances to the American government, but also have Japanese shakai hoken deductions made on his American-earned salary AS WELL and that money sent to the Japanese government because if he doesn't when he gets transferred back to Japan at some hypothetical (=made up) date in the future he will owe 2 years of back payments before he can use his health insurance again?

                                Originally posted by Effected After View Post
                                This is his SOP. He makes guesses based on how he thinks thing should be, and phrase them as fact. Sometimes he's right but usually that's usually just coincidence, not actually based in any knowledge of these facts. It's fairly rare that he actually knows what he's talking about.
                                exactly. Its also rare he reads anything before replying. Mind you, there's not really much point to reading before answering since the 'information' in the form of 'fact' has already been predetermined.

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